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Arsène Wenger: Same Old Class

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redanddread

The stone that the builders refuse
For all your admiration of Liverpool, their slight advantage on us has meant nothing in terms of success. One League Cup in the last decade is hardly worth worrying about. Nobody will recall our 2nd place to Leicester a couple of years back, or their victories in the league over us.

I just wish we would at least go back to entertaining football if winning is not possible. That is the only thing they have over us for now.
I have no ****ing admiration for Liverpool. I'm just saying they are a better football team than us at present and if people have a tough time with that I recommend you watch the games between us over the last 2 years.
 

redanddread

The stone that the builders refuse
Well this season will give us a good indicator, wont it.

I know where you are coming from. Arséne Wenger is not delivering anymore and as a result we are looking hopeless.

But I'll also bring your attention to one thing... the day Wenger leaves, the Premier League and Europe will know that there is a good chance the sleeping giant will reawaken.
You don't have to bring that to my attention. I'm fully aware of that and have argued that point on this forum.
 

SA Gunner

Hates Tierney And Wants Him Sold Immediately
Moderator

Country: South Africa

Player:Nketiah
You don't have to bring that to my attention. I'm fully aware of that and have argued that point on this forum.

No no, I insist.

Let me bring your attention to it.

Dont forget, that this is a superclub now. You think Liverpool and Tottenham have our resources? Think again.
 

redanddread

The stone that the builders refuse
No no, I insist.

Let me bring your attention to it.

Dont forget, that this is a superclub now. You think Liverpool and Tottenham have our resources? Think again.

Ok, OK!

Bro, I've argued that we have better resources than some super rich clubs. However, we don't have a manager and up till recent a BoD that appears to want to use our resources to their fullest.
 

Makingtrax

Worships in the house of Wenger 🙏
Trusted ⭐

Country: England

Player:Saliba
But I'll also bring your attention to one thing... the day Wenger leaves, the Premier League and Europe will know that there is a good chance the sleeping giant will reawaken.
Chelsea were a sleeping giant. Won **** all since 1905.

Suddenly they awoke and won 5 titles in 13 years. A beautiful fairy tale.All it needed was a good manager to get them organised. Wait . . .:lol:
 

redanddread

The stone that the builders refuse
Now I know you've lost the plot :lol:
whether something is done 10% of the time or 80% of the time....it's still being done and it's being done all the time as that 10% doesn't occur all at the same time. Use your noggin mate. There are instances of football's paupers mugging off the big boys all the time. just to spell it out to you so you clearly see my argument and we'll only take the last 10 years.

England - 2016 - Leicester
Germany - 2011/12 - Dortmund
Spain - 2014 - Atleti
France - 2011/12/16 - Lille/Montpellier/Monaco
Holland - 2017 - Feyenoord (although they are traditionally one of the big 3)


So in 2011, 2012, 2014, 2016 & 2017 (5 out of 7 years) there were clubs in 5 of the top 6 leagues in Europe that bucked the trend and won their league despite not being the wealthiest or even the 2nd wealthiest in the land.

It happens ALL the time.
 

redanddread

The stone that the builders refuse
Chelsea were a sleeping giant. Won **** all since 1905.

Suddenly they awoke and won 5 titles in 13 years. A beautiful fairy tale.All it needed was a good manager to get them organised. Wait . . .:lol:
Well actually they needed a good manager who understood how to get the best from their resources. They also recruited well and put together a team that will go down as one of the best teams in English football history.
 

BigPoppaPump

Reeling from Laca & Kos nightmares
I don't get how we're still talking about squad cost. The fact of the matter is there's 3 teams that can spend ridiculous amounts to buy the best players in Europe, we can't compete with that. We're not poor and can be doing much better in the transfer market, but let's not act like Leicester or Dortmund winning league titles means Arsenal should.
 

Makingtrax

Worships in the house of Wenger 🙏
Trusted ⭐

Country: England

Player:Saliba
whether something is done 10% of the time or 80% of the time....it's still being done and it's being done all the time as that 10% doesn't occur all at the same time. Use your noggin mate. There are instances of football's paupers mugging off the big boys all the time. just to spell it out to you so you clearly see my argument and we'll only take the last 10 years.

England - 2016 - Leicester
Germany - 2011/12 - Dortmund
Spain - 2014 - Atleti
France - 2011/12/16 - Lille/Montpellier/Monaco
Holland - 2017 - Feyenoord (although they are traditionally one of the big 3)


So in 2011, 2012, 2014, 2016 & 2017 (5 out of 7 years) there were clubs in 5 of the top 6 leagues in Europe that bucked the trend and won their league despite not being the wealthiest or even the 2nd wealthiest in the land.

It happens ALL the time.
Once in 13 years isn't all the time. And you can work out the the odds.

There are 17 other teams in the league all trying to knock those three big spenders off the perch by drills and good organisation because they can't match player quality.

So in 13 years thats 17 x 13 attempts which over 200 tries. One made it in 2016, so on average you've got less than a 200 to 1 chance.

Oh well, maybe someone will knock them off this year. :lol:
 

karl

Well-Known Member
I have no ****ing admiration for Liverpool. I'm just saying they are a better football team than us at present and if people have a tough time with that I recommend you watch the games between us over the last 2 years.
I just think you are comparing the minor differences between two losers. The real comparison with Liverpool is that they are following in our tracks, but a few years behind. We both have the ability to gift goals at any time though
 

redanddread

The stone that the builders refuse
@Makingtrax What's even more damning for Arsène is that he has consistently failed to take advantage of the upheaval that all of the other 4 major clubs have experienced in the last 5 years - a time when Arsenal had more money.

All of City, UTD., Chelsea & Liverpool have gone through restructuring, re-organziation, re-tooling on the managerial and playing staff side, yet here we stand now, beneath all of them and a few FA Cups aside, we haven't been able to make our stability in management and playing staff pay dividends at the top end.
 

Wilshere1010

Active Member
I have no ****ing admiration for Liverpool. I'm just saying they are a better football team than us at present and if people have a tough time with that I recommend you watch the games between us over the last 2 years.
Exactly. And even if you don't believe Liverpool are a better team than us, there is a clear picture of progression over the last few years. Whether someone wants to argue they have overtaken us yet or not, they are clearly on the right path. Even the sale of the best player, they got enough money in return to replace him, and Keita is already on the way. Meanwhile we are just running in place.
 

redanddread

The stone that the builders refuse
I don't get how we're still talking about squad cost. The fact of the matter is there's 3 teams that can spend ridiculous amounts to buy the best players in Europe, we can't compete with that. We're not poor and can be doing much better in the transfer market, but let's not act like Leicester or Dortmund winning league titles means Arsenal should.
If you review Arsenal's recent history you'll find that there are 4 separate times when Arsenal should/could have won the league, since the "money" era started. The reason we failed to do so had nothing to do with the fact that we didn't have enough money. No one is saying that Arsenal should win the league but what many are saying is that we should be performing better and at least challenging. Arsène can get his team into the mix but his teams have shown a weakness & not only succumbed but capitulated when faced with the pressure of a title race

Arsène Wenger hasn't come close to challenging for a league title in 14 years and if you think that the reason is all to do with money then I can't help you bro.
 

redanddread

The stone that the builders refuse
I just think you are comparing the minor differences between two losers. The real comparison with Liverpool is that they are following in our tracks, but a few years behind. We both have the ability to gift goals at any time though

What do you mean by this exactly?

Liverpool have a goal difference of 25 compared to our 12. Simply put, if they concede goals as easily they also score much more easily.
 

dashsnow17

Doesn’t Rate Any Of Our Attackers
Trusted ⭐
The idea that we're a sleeping giant only held back by Wenger is erroneous. We're a sleeping giant, yes, but it's not Wenger holding us back: it's what goes on at boardroom level and especially at ownership level that's holding us back.

Wenger makes glaring mistakes and he makes those mistakes over and over again. You can certainly argue another manager would get more out of this set of players than Wenger can. But to think Wenger leaving will suddenly open the floodgates and we'll start winning the league again is just fanciful.
 

karl

Well-Known Member
What do you mean by this exactly?

Liverpool have a goal difference of 25 compared to our 12. Simply put, if they concede goals as easily they also score much more easily.
That's where we were are few years ago in playing attractive football and scoring plenty, but having a leaky defence. Once the goals dry up you are in trouble.
 

redanddread

The stone that the builders refuse
That's where we were are few years ago in playing attractive football and scoring plenty, but having a leaky defence. Once the goals dry up you are in trouble.
Unfortunately the goals don't look like drying up anytime soon. They still need a top keeper though. With any luck Arsène will lend Klopp his little black book of keepers and Jurgen will take the bait.
 

karl

Well-Known Member
Unfortunately the goals don't look like drying up anytime soon. They still need a top keeper though. With any luck Arséne will lend Klopp his little black book of keepers and Jurgen will take the bait.
Ospina would be a good buy for them and I would prefer to see Macey as backup!

On the goals. I didn't envisage ours drying up, but confidence is a fragile thing along with injuries being unpredictable.
 
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