Discussion in 'Arsenal Talk' started by OnlyOne, Dec 20, 2019.
Think we all know how that meeting will go...
Love the fact that he called out the refs re the Vardy-Mustafi incident.
Nice to see a bit of a fight from the manager.
Almost everytime we lose or draw this season, I can't help but think that if that little prat Kos hadn't quit by media and being such a **** in the way he handled things, we'd be in far better shape.
This kinda reminds me of the Chelsea game at home. Leicester switch to a back 4 and outnumber us in midfield now. Xhaka-Cellabos lack of athleticism really gets shown up and they struggle to hold onto the ball. I wonder if Arteta could have taken Kola off, put Pepe on and match them man to man. Their fullbacks were pants and we really should have gone for them.
CL was not possible before the game. You’d have to have delusions of grandeur to think we had hope. Top 4 was lost during Emery’s reign. 5th won’t get CL.
Brilliant first half but the second half was pretty much just as bad as the first half was good.
This is really the way it has been under Arteta for the majority of it, good first halves but, especially, when we take the lead, we cede far too much control of the game and take up rather Mourinhista/Cholista tactics. He should've learned from the Olympiakos disaster as well as the games against Sheffield United or really almost all of our 2nd half performances this season that this is not the way to go.
I get that the players might not be able to do what he asks of them over the course of the 90 minutes but that doesn't explain such conservativism, dropping off, ceding possession, and basically looking to counter, especially now with 5 subs available. It's clearly a tactical thing or a thing where he's not getting them to play in the 2nd halves, which either way is down to him.
I remain cautiously optimistic that he is being pragmatic and conservative in the short term with sub-optimal personnel in hopes of building something more interesting long term, but there are some worrying signs and his conservatism has really hurt us in this match and the Olympiakos match and we are as such without a hope of Champions League football next season. I hope he learns from these mistakes as well because his game management when he have a lead is not effective, and while I can understand he comes in and has his own ideas and maybe doesn't want to just copy Guardiola swinging to the other side of the spectrum with this real poor game management, with the same subs and second half approach every time that invites pressure and concedes far too much control, is not the answer.
Anyone who can't see the already transformative impact Arteta has had on this team is either on a wind up or knows very little about how football works.
Today was actually very encouraging. We spent 20 minute getting the measure of Leicester, then spent 25 minutes tearing into them and should have scored 3.
Unfortunately we have the same problem. Weak squad that limits rotation options alongside poor stamina levels among too many players means we run out of steam. Too many of our players can't sustain playing with intensity for 90 minutes, and its been a problem at the club for half a decade or more. Of course, if Laca was Bergkamp or Henry or similar, and we had a Vieira centrally, we'd kill games off and be able to coast a lot more!
But the performance level of almost every player has improved under Arteta which is not something we've been able to say for a number of years.
The very fact people are disappointed about tonight shows Arteta's impact.
Yup, 4 points from Leicester and Wolves
His tactics are quite similar to Emery.
But he's shown that he is a much better game and man manager.
38% possession (yes, 20 minutes a man down, but it's certainly fair to say you can create and play more a man down than we did, it looked like we were 9v11 not 10) at home against Leicester. We all know the pitfalls of the possession stat but it reveals at least a little bit globally about our control (or lack thereof) and our intentions and tactical set-up.
It's fair to critique. Our results haven't improved that greatly nor have our underlying metrics (xG, shots on goal vs. shots conceded), and Arteta was picking up from a very, very low bar with Emery, make no mistake, he's a terrible manager. We've improved but there is still room for critique.
The squad is hugely flawed but it is not as bad as people make out. Not much in it between our squad and Leicester's and certainly good enough to be having more than 38% of the ball if the intentions are there. Ceballos and Xhaka are better passers and footballers than their Leicester counterparts in midfield today, and without Maddison, Pereira, and Chilwell we put out in reality a better team. At halftime Rodgers corrected his mistake of putting out Barnes and made it more even on paper, but still, it wasn't for that type of Leicester second half domination.
Yes Xhaka and Ceballos don't have great physical conditions to press and play a dominating style but that is the manager's job...no team played a more dominating style than Guardiola's Barça and the typical Busquets-Xavi-Iniesta is not a midfield full of athletes to say the least. Obviously it's apples and oranges in terms of quality but the point stands that if the intentions and the coaching/instructions were there, you can certainly play more positive football at this point into his management here. The fact is Arteta has gone to a back 5, and makes very conservative substitutions like Willock for the RW, and has a very conservative second half approach almost always (especially when leading), for a reason.
So yeah, his conservative, Cholista tactics in the second half are just that: his tactics. If he's just learning on the job or if he's got some ideas about being conservative in the short term to later evolve to a different style later on we don't know. But while Arteta is a bit of a unique case in that this is his first big managerial job it's also fair to be concerned by some of the signs...I'm not sure I can think of any example of a manager who exhibited tendencies quite different at a later point in his career from those he showed initially. I think a manager's tendencies or personality tends to stay pretty stable but let's hope that Arteta is a unique case there as he is otherwise in some respects.
The team did seem very disorganised at 10 men but unfortunately the sending off came just after the drinks break. It must’ve disrupted the whole tactics talk Arteta gave in that break and so the players at that stage wouldn’t have known how to respond to the sending off or what to do. Arteta was unable to communicate an adjusted plan.
In the second half; before the sending off I felt that the plan was to drop deeper but despite conceding possession we were in control of the game. Leicester hadn’t threatened us.
It definitely bothers me that we cede possession for seemingly entire halves.
Impressive even with Emery’s remains still on the team.
Next season with a new midfield and a properly moulded Arteta team is an exciting prospect.
We are a top four team since Arteta joined.
It's not a perfect world with us, but the signs are absolutely encouraging and I'd favor us for a clear top four finish next season, especially if Arteta gets a bit of support in the market to do the basics he wants to, like Partey.
Deem all other clubs like ManU, Chelsea, Leicester and co to be very lucky that Arteta did not join earlier, at the point everyone expected him to, at the international break.
Interesting thread , but I guess we have to wait and see how we play next season. Hopefully with players he needs.
Xhaka and Dani made Ndidi and Tielemans look like amateurs while it was 11vs11
It’s a poor thread though.
Arteta’s had around 15 games with a squad largely acknowledged to be a mix of poor or underperforming players. Throw the long break into the mix and what the hell do people expect?
Anyone hating at this point was likely an Emery stan, and there opinions are pretty worthless anyway.
It's a terrible thread! Who is that clown?
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