• ! ! ! IMPORTANT MESSAGE ! ! !

    Discussions about police investigations

    In light of recent developments about a player from Premier League being arrested and until there is an official announcement, ALL users should refrain from discussing or speculating about situations around personal off-pitch matters related to any Arsenal player. This is to protect you and the forum.

    Users who disregard this reminder will be issued warnings and their posts will get deleted from public.

PL: Manchester United vs Arsenal | 09/04/06

Canuck

Established Member
Hand ball while defending or attacking is cheating, end of.
Though I can't help but feel that a striker controlling in the box with his arm is the more serious of the two.

Besides, that's one of the few times it's happened this season while Terry and Dogbarf seem to be making a habit of it lately.

No...no double standard here. :wink:
 

tristan

Active Member
RocktheCasbah said:
tristan said:
Seriously. Regarding the Toure save, how hard were you guys on Drogba for blatant handball? Now when your lot does the exact same thing you're laughing and praising him. Tad hypocritical, no?

I'm sure even a Chelsea fan like yourself is well aware of the "ref" justice Arsenal have suffered at Old Trafford across the last four years so the answer to that should be obvious, we'll take it when we get it.

Besides which, Senderos would have blocked the shot anyway.

That's not my point. Had it been John Terry, Rio Ferdinand, Ledley King, Jamie Carragher, anyone else in the Premiership, I'd make the educated guess that you (you being the arsenal mania community in general) would be up in arms over the missed call, and that the player is an obvious cheater and that the ref obviously favours such and such a team over Arsenal because how in the world could anyone miss that call? I've been reading threads here for many months and I'm almost positive that that would be the reaction. Despite my allegiance to Chelsea I can state without hesitation that the times Drogba has handled should have been straight reds, no question, he quite obviously handled it on purpose. Haven't seen anyone claim that such an intentional hand ball by Toure should even merit a yellow, let alone a red. And trying to say it's somehow justified because Arsenal gets screwed by the refs at Old Trafford a lot is just rubbish, cheating is cheating. Home teams generally get an advantage from officials anyway. It explains why an assistant across the field with an obstructed view can call a sure hand ball on Drogba at Craven Cottage, but when it's in plain sight at Stamford Bridge it's ignored.

Saying Senderos would've stopped it anyway doesn't change anything either. Had Drogba handled the crosses in a legal manner it's likely he would have scored anyway.
 

awooga83

Established Member
I don't think anyone is saying its justified, it was a handball and we got lucky, the decision wasn't called if it had been i don't think anyone would have had any arguments as it was handball. But seeing as many players have got away with more blatent handballs including Terry's wonder save this season, then its just good to get a lucky break for once when Toure makes one handball, seeing as other players consistently break that rule with impunity.

That doesn't mean to say it should be done but if Terry can do it 5 or 6 times in a season and get no punishment no ones going to make a big deal if Toure gets the same treatment.
 

nazo

Established Member
Gurgen said:
Both were poor, but Adebayor was slightly better.

That said, I'd shoot from distance too if there was nobody to be seen for 20 yards except for Robert Pires taking a stroll in the sunshine, and Ferdinand and Vidic were about to close me down. RvP had no support at all and did what he could. Whack it at goal.

I might as well put my bit in this.
I agree with what Gurgen says. Our team was so disjointed that i couldn't believe my eyes. Rvp would recieve the ball and instinctly take a fast shot because that was truely the only way to score with no support and with United players closing down on him so fast. I also agree that he tried to do some individual stuff and didn't pass the ball around too often. He did some good things but some other bad ones.

From what i saw in the game, Ade only started to play better in the second half (second half of the second half to be specific). In the first half it looked like he was just walking around and just passing the ball back to other players once he recieved it. He tried to head the ball a couple of times but a United player would jump for the rebound and advance. Someone (rvp, midfield) should've stayed back and took the ball but that's how it was. Also you can't say that Rvp tried some individual stuff while Ade didn't. Ade would actually take on a player then pass it back to another United player. I was like wtf?? the whole time.

Pires was worthless through the whole game. He was soooo slow and took too much time on the ball. He would recieve the ball then wait, wait, wait, wait...etc then pass it and hopefully someone would get it. Gilberto was pretty good. Cesc was tooo tired and couldn't pass a ball fast enough because all the United players were too fresh for him. Hleb was pretty good too. Eboue was tired. Toure looked really tired. Senderos was decent. Flamini is a freaking stamina machine. He runs runs runs and runs all day without getting tired. He was the only player actually going back and forth through the pitch. Lehmann was decent with his saves and couldn't do anything about the goals. Diaby should've started. He was fresh and tried to help out. Freddie looked really fresh when he came on. I think he could've scored if it wasn't for Ferdinand making a good tackle at the right time. Henry ACTUALLY touched the ball once and that was when he first entered the pitch.

We lost this game because our players were too tired. The first 15 minutes prove that. We looked good then all of a sudden the players felt tired and that's when they started to attack us more. Flamini was the only tireless player.
 

_scorpion_

Established Member
kel varnsen said:
RocktheCasbah said:
vanderguy said:
Scorpion you are a gutless coward if van persie hits form and you start praising him then i will know you are a coward.you are adebayor's lil fan boy.why cant you reply my post about rooney and van persie without being stupid why?you are coward who fantasies about adebayor. :?

Maybe because your post about van Persie being better than Rooney is a load of bollocks?

I'm not really sure what Adebayor did so wrong on Sunday that merits the comments he has received. He played much more intelligently than the boy wonder.

disagree. ade has played well so far, but was very poor on sunday. van persie worked much harder, moved far better off the ball and was basically our only goal threat up front. ade was lousy in the first half and slightly better in the 2nd. all in all, a very disappointing match from him...

Funny.

So on the days it suits you our midfeild is teh reson for our underperforming strikers....yet on other days...its the strikers fault?
Did you actually watch the match? Our mid feild was tired and crippled by the fact that Pires was in the mix.

Ade and RVP could only do what they did. I'm not faulting neither of them on that performance at all. They were not the reason why we lost the match.

My point all along has been that Ade partners henry better than anyone else in the squad...and then you turn around and say "Deal with it".

I don't have to deal with it son...Wenger deals with it and his actions are always louder than words.

I have never said RVP is a crappy player...i have not even come close to suggesting his skill is less than Ade's....but everytime I post on the matter (or anyone else who has a similar opinion to mine) we get people (and I'm not including you - although your 'deal with it' suprised me) who clearly are so fan struck about RVP that they fail to see that he is not the best partner for Henry in our squad upfront at the moment. Maybe when he recovers his form he may prove me wrong, but I seriously doubt it as I have seen what Ade can do and i have always maintained that RVP is better off the bench.

Like I said in my reply to Tegh, I tried to bait the fanboys (particularly about that 'easy miss' in front of goal) i thought you would see that (as I do) when reading some of your posts that tend to rub people off the wrong way quite often.

I know RVP's strengths and weaknesses...and I know Ade's too. Clearly there are people that can comment on the two of them without any bias and clearly there are some regretting the RVP tatoo on their asses at the moment.
 

raphael_as

Active Member
Despite my allegiance to Chelsea I can state without hesitation that the times Drogba has handled should have been straight reds, no question, he quite obviously handled it on purpose. Haven't seen anyone claim that such an intentional hand ball by Toure should even merit a yellow, let alone a red.
Why would we? He's our player - sure it should have merited at least a yellow (I'm not entirely convinced it was an intentional handball, but he definately flung himself at the ball and it hit his hands), but why in the hell would we sit here and talk about it.

Everyone knows it was handball, everyone knows we got lucky and we lost the game anyway....end of.

Do you lot spend hours agonising over Drogba's handballs? (I honestly don't know since I don't bother trolling other teams websites).
 

Biggus

Established Member
tristan said:
Seriously. Regarding the Toure save, how hard were you guys on Drogba for blatant handball? Now when your lot does the exact same thing you're laughing and praising him. Tad hypocritical, no?

Seriously Tristan, Big difference in falling over another player and protecting your face as the ball is blasted at it which Kolo has done once. And the kind of defending which was taken to an art form by Stefan Henchoz and John Terry and involves making yourself as big as possible and is done countless times.

http://www.arsenal-mania.com/forum/view ... sc&start=0
 

Lukazan

Established Member
tristan said:
That's not my point. Had it been John Terry, Rio Ferdinand, Ledley King, Jamie Carragher, anyone else in the Premiership, I'd make the educated guess that you (you being the arsenal mania community in general) would be up in arms over the missed call, and that the player is an obvious cheater and that the ref obviously favours such and such a team over Arsenal because how in the world could anyone miss that call? I've been reading threads here for many months and I'm almost positive that that would be the reaction. Despite my allegiance to Chelsea I can state without hesitation that the times Drogba has handled should have been straight reds, no question, he quite obviously handled it on purpose. Haven't seen anyone claim that such an intentional hand ball by Toure should even merit a yellow, let alone a red.

Gurgen said:
Arsenal get lucky at OT.

That was a blatant John Terry style save and a straigh red for Toure tbh. Let's be honest.

There you go.

But really, what's the point in every member of the forum making a post to state the incident was a red card when it's so obvious?

Besides, this is the first time Toure has handled the ball in the area to deny a goal scoring opportunity, the first time John Terry did it I wasn't fussed, I thought it was just a genuine balls up from the ref.. second time he did it and got away with it I started to wonder and by the third and fourth times it's just getting ridiculous.
 

Jkreffer

Established Member
Quite simply, he should have been sent off. It was just incredible luck on our part that the referee missed it.

Either that or the ref chose to ignore it in fear of ruining the spectacle, but I very much doubt this was the case.
 

Biggus

Established Member
Jkreffer said:
Quite simply, he should have been sent off. It was just incredible luck on our part that the referee missed it.

God knows Jkreffer we deserve some after this season.
 

GenerationRed

New Member
dafish said:
i think there were a number of reasons we lost the match.

1) ball possesion. we gave it away in the middle or at the edge of their box far too many times. we like to play wide and stay on the wings, but we give it away when we try to cut it back into the middle.

2) support from each other. there has been many moves where it looked like a one man show where helb, ade or eboue preferred the dribble over the pass when it was obvious they were going no where, even if they had beat the man.

3) In my opinion the BIGGEST mistake is formation. we are the meanest defense in Europe because we played 4-5-1 and when we do, its damn near impossible to out muscle a midfield consisting 3 of cesc, gilberto, diaby, or freddy in the middle. Wenger i felt rested Henry because he'd be satisfied with a draw in my opinion. so why the attacking formation of 4-4-2? i really wonder.

Gilberto had to run all night to plug gay-boy and giggs depending on which side they attack, and if he fails, toure or senderos had to cover the full backs, leaving a huge hole in the box, opening up not so much for the striker, because one CB will still be free to mark him, but the AM in Rooney which is where gilberto is suppose to be.

Thats the way i saw it too,it frustrating to see us persisting with 4-4-2 away from home.
 

Latest posts+

Top Bottom