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Ratings and post-match discussion vs Sp**s

Man of the Match?

  • Laurent Koscielny

    Votes: 39 43.8%
  • Jack Wilshere

    Votes: 37 41.6%
  • Samir Nasri

    Votes: 9 10.1%
  • Andrei Arshavin

    Votes: 4 4.5%
  • Other

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Total voters
    89
  • Poll closed .

Captain

Established Member
ricky1985 said:
No way was what Djourou did correct. You can't step up and leave your man completely free on the edge of your own box when there is absolutely no pressure on the passer of the ball. In that case it's a complete and utter gamble.

How do you spring an offside trap then?

At the point he stepped out Keane was clearly left in an offside position.

Why did Gibbs step back in, he wasn't marking anyone and the ball was never coming over there.
 

goonerwarsh

Established Member
Fabianski - 5 - If you look at his game overall game, he was ok. His distribution was good. But time after time when you need him to produce the goods he lets you down. That should be his last chance because having in goal will cost us at least a goal a game and it just isn't good enough for Arsenal

Eboue - 7 - I feel a bit bad for Eboue with some of the stick he's been getting for this performance. I thought he worked tirelessly down that side. He was up and down like a bride's gown. He was caught out of position a few times but it was more down to us losing possesion up field when he was supporting the attack. Apart from his wayward shot I thought he was really intelligent and calm in possesion.

Djourou - 7 - Yeah he was a bit rusty. The challenge on Bentley was particularly weak when he left him with a clear run at our goal. However I thought he really grew in confidence as the match went on and put in a good performance. I think it's important to remember the good things these players do without always picking out the bad. And Djourou did some good things in a pressure match I think.

Koscielny - 9 - Brilliant performance. Calm and dependable. Will be loved as much as Verminator with the fans if he continues with gutsy and intelligent performances like this.

Gibbs - 8 - This lad is going to be a great player for us. Should have been rewarded with a goal. Overall did a very good job on Aaron Lennon who has made many a more experienced defender look ****.

Lansbury - 7 - Worked his bollocks off, nice take for the goal. Anyone who scores against Sp**s is a top bloke in my book...apart from Adebayor...and now Gallas

Denilson - 7 - I'm not his biggest fan but put in a good shift I thought and looked pretty good out there. Linked well with all the other good ball players around him. Shooting was waaaaay off.

Wilshere - 9 - As said before he was brilliant in the first half in particular. And never stopped running, passing and moving the whole entire 120 minutes. Was scythed down time and time again and just kept a cool head. This boy is a huge part of the future of Arsenal.

Nasri - 7 - Considering we were coming into this game having missed a penalty in the previous game albeit not him. Against your arch rivals at their ground in extra time, the pressure is on and our boy rose to the occasion - twice. Maybe not his best game but he contributed and kept the ball well.

Rosicky - 7 - A good performance from Rosicky without ever being spectacular. Lost the ball dangerously a few times in the first half.

Vela - 7 - Ran a lot, and put in a lot of effort. He was isolated and he isn't built to play the role in the same manner Chamack or Robin are. I love Vela though I must admit.

Arshavin - 7 - This guy is a complete enigma. Looks like a fat little leprechaun running round the pitch. Was losing possesion lots and then all of a sudden two assists for the penalty shouts and a goal.

Chamakh - 7 - Gave us presence up front, could have scored when the ball flashed across goal in front of him. Pain in the arse for tired defenders.

Clichy - 7 - Thought he looked good and solid when he came on.
 

qs

Established Member
ricky1985 said:
Shue said:
How exactly does Djourou get a 5 in a 4-1 away win, when he wasn't remotely at fault for their offside goal?
Seriously, mate, go to 101 great goals and watch that goal again and then come back here an tell me Djourou wasn't at fault for the goal. What he did was absolutely unbelievable. I just can't see what hew as trying to achieve.

If you successfully apply the offside trap and the linesman ignores it how is that your fault?
 

Yousif Arsenal

On Vinai's payroll & misses 4th place trophy šŸ†
Trusted ā­
well about this perfect game i can say thx you arsenal and ArsĆØne we enjoy beat spuds and make they fans cry

Fabianski 5 you are 25 years old and you still cant catch weak balls im really disappointed

Eboue 6 very good first half poor 2nd half but he did well

Kosh 9 what is that he not lose one tackle or ball from air another great siging from le boss well done Kosh

DJ 6 very poor he is not cover well he get rape many times hope he fix his performance

Gibbs 8 great game great performance but sad he is injuried hope he not take long to return

dede 7 good game he show us he is very good player i hope he keep going

wilshere 9 MOTM for me what a game what a great performance run all the game he did not fell the tired well done wilshere

nasri 7 well the tow pens i rate you 7 but the game performance was poor you lose the ball many times very heavy but you did ok

rozza 7 alot of wrong passes but he did well for me

vela 6 well for me this player cant play alone in forword he need one with him to do something

Lansbury 8 great game great performance a nice goal well done lans keep going you will be in first team very soon

Subs

arsha 7 all i can say he changed the game 2 nice pass made the pens and a nice goal

chamakh 7 win us alot of fouls made nice passes

clichy N/A
 

ricky1985

Established Member
qs said:
ricky1985 said:
Shue said:
How exactly does Djourou get a 5 in a 4-1 away win, when he wasn't remotely at fault for their offside goal?
Seriously, mate, go to 101 great goals and watch that goal again and then come back here an tell me Djourou wasn't at fault for the goal. What he did was absolutely unbelievable. I just can't see what hew as trying to achieve.

If you successfully apply the offside trap and the linesman ignores it how is that your fault?
It's a completely unnecessary gamble - that's the point. If he just stays with Keane there's no danger whatsoever. He just positions himself between Keane and the passer of the ball and he's in total control.

When you factor in that the passer of the ball had no pressure on him at all - which means he can potentially play any pass at any moment, and also that Kieran Gibbs was at least as deep as Djouoru when he made his decision. It was just wrong, wrong, wrong. Djourou had no other option but to get extremely tight to Keane and force the passer into playing the best pass you've ever seen to get Keane in. Anything else was a gamble, anything could happen: Gibbs might not quite get up, the linesman might get his call wrong, Keane might manage to hold his run/bend his run.

It's all about playing the percentages, and that was clearly not the right thing to do.
 

asajoseph

Established Member
Fabianski - 5

Eboue - 6
Koscielny - 8
Djourou - 5
Gibbs - 8

Denilson - 7
Lansbury - 7
Wilshere - 9

Nasri - 7
Vela - 5
Rosicky - 7

Clichy - 7
Chamakh (too pissed to remember)
Arshavin - 7
 

3Z

Active Member
Klaus Daimler said:
3Z said:
Wilshere is amazing. So good for 18... Better than Fabregas at the same age? Cant be dropped at the moment.
Well, Cesc at that age scored against Juventus and raped Real Madrid's midfield on Bernabeu. Wilshere is easily the second most impressive eighteen year-old I've seen in an Arsenal shirt though!

Agreed. Just thought it would be interesting to read opinion on that question. Cesc had played a lot more by 18 than Jack has though. Regardless, for me the thought of Cesc and Jack in midfield together in future games really excites me. I only hope they get chances TOGETHER.
 

Clrnc

Established Member
Trusted ā­

Player:Tomiyasu
Told ya I knew alot of people would defend Djourou's action as springing the offside trap. Its correct in one sense, but its poor positional play as well. Koscielny would have kept him tight and clear the ball easily.

Nevertheless, its a positive comeback from Djourou in a not so easy game so its fine for me. He passed the ball from the back superbly which is why we controlled the match quite easily, same for Kos.

Btw Asa, why are you pissed at Chamakh?
 

Gooner_Stu

Established Member
Clrnc said:
Btw Asa, why are you pissed at Chamakh?

think he means intoxicated then angry :wink:

Recording the highlights for my old man who missed the game. Worth rewatching when i get home later :D
 

Klaus Daimler

Established Member
ricky1985 said:
qs said:
If you successfully apply the offside trap and the linesman ignores it how is that your fault?
It's a completely unnecessary gamble - that's the point. If he just stays with Keane there's no danger whatsoever. He just positions himself between Keane and the passer of the ball and he's in total control.
You can't really fault Djourou for doing his job in that situation while ignoring the poor positioning from Gibbs, who didn't even have a player to mark. He had no business being that deep into our half and was caught watching the ball rather than the rest of the defence. It's not a terrible sin or anything, especially not as it still worked and Keane should've been blown off, but Gibbs was definitely the one who made the linesman think that the offside trap was unsuccessful. Djourou had several shaky moments in the game but he did nothing wrong at their goal. He did exactly what he should do in a situation like that.
 

qs

Established Member
ricky1985 said:
qs said:
If you successfully apply the offside trap and the linesman ignores it how is that your fault?
It's a completely unnecessary gamble - that's the point. If he just stays with Keane there's no danger whatsoever. He just positions himself between Keane and the passer of the ball and he's in total control.

When you factor in that the passer of the ball had no pressure on him at all - which means he can potentially play any pass at any moment, and also that Kieran Gibbs was at least as deep as Djouoru when he made his decision. It was just wrong, wrong, wrong. Djourou had no other option but to get extremely tight to Keane and force the passer into playing the best pass you've ever seen to get Keane in. Anything else was a gamble, anything could happen: Gibbs might not quite get up, the linesman might get his call wrong, Keane might manage to hold his run/bend his run.

It's all about playing the percentages, and that was clearly not the right thing to do.

Theres no percentages to it. The pass to Keane was made so Djourou was right as he left Keane offside. If Gibbs hadn't got out quick enough it'd have been Gibbs mistake not Djourous, but Gibbs did get out. The linesman **** up, not Djourou. And then Flappy was horrible for the shot.

Djourou was in no way responsible for that goal.
 

Timleaf

Established Member
I thought Djourou was alright. A bit sloppy now and then, but I think the basic package is all there. He just needs games. Having him as 4th choice is a hell of a lot stronger than last season when we had Silvestre as 3rd choice.
 

ricky1985

Established Member
Klaus Daimler said:
ricky1985 said:
qs said:
If you successfully apply the offside trap and the linesman ignores it how is that your fault?
It's a completely unnecessary gamble - that's the point. If he just stays with Keane there's no danger whatsoever. He just positions himself between Keane and the passer of the ball and he's in total control.
You can't really fault Djourou for doing his job in that situation while ignoring the poor positioning from Gibbs, who didn't even have a player to mark. He had no business being that deep into our half and was caught watching the ball rather than the rest of the defence. It's not a terrible sin or anything, especially not as it still worked and Keane should've been blown off, but Gibbs was definitely the one who made the linesman think that the offside trap was unsuccessful. Djourou had several shaky moments in the game but he did nothing wrong at their goal. He did exactly what he should do in a situation like that.
Gibbs should have been 2 yards further up the pitch, I never once said he shouldn't.

Ask any coach, anywhere, whether they want their player doing what Djourou did in that position and I promise you they'd say no. It's **** and can go wrong so easy.

If Djourou stays tight there is no danger. It's as simple as that. There are times to play offside, but that was a bad decision. Deal with the danger and then there's no problem.

He took a HUGE unnecessary gamble, given Kieran Gibbs' position, and the extremely dangerous position that Robbie Keane was in. If you don't catch the guy offside, or more to the point, if the offside isn't given, then it's a certain chance for the attacker because you've taken yourself out of the game. Staying tight, putting yourself between the passer and the receiver, is playing the percentages, that's what you're taught.
 

outlaw_member

Established Member
You should never play the offside trap, if the opponent ball carrier isn't sufficiently pressured. It was incredibly risky of Djourou to step up in that situation, but he did time it correctly. It was Gibbs who wandered backwards into playing Keane onside, or seemingly so for the linesman. Not to mention that Gibbs was at fault again for the exact same careless positioning, later on. Also, I'm very surprised at the number of high ratings he has received. Although, he was impressive offensively, I didn't see an outstanding performance warranting an 8. It's not like he got a couple of assists, or had some great offensive or defensive play. Even attacking wise, he was cutting inside far too often, and barely provided any purposeful width. If Clichy had made those mistakes, somehow I think the reaction would have been different.
 

Segway

Well-Known Member
I voted for Koscielny. Impeccable performance from him and he looks like another of Wenger's little master strokes.
 

ricky1985

Established Member
BTW - talk of us fielding an "experienced side" last night. The average age of their starting XI: 23.8, average age of our starting XI: 22.9.

Can we help it if our youngsters are far superior to their youngsters?

That's without mentioning that they played the majority of the game with Lennon and Keane on the pitch.
 

qs

Established Member
In fairness to Gibbs he had Livermore and then Lennon in his pocket all night.

Agree about the Clichy comment but its hardly surprising given the hate Gael gets on here.
 

Iloveyouarsenewenger

Established Member
Kos - 8.5, Wilshere - 8.5, Arsh - 8.5

Gibbs - 7.5, Nasri - 7.5 (Extra point for two coolly taken pens and awesome celebrations after that)

Chamkah - 7, Rosicky - 7, Denilson - 7, Lansbury - 7(0.5 extra for goal)

Vela - 6.5, Eboue - 6.5

Fabianski - 5.5

Clichy - NA

Now, coming to general comments, Denilson looks an improved footballer this season and the improvement looks like a direct result of his physical growth. I've been impressed with his ability to keep hold of possession and he can not be just pushed or shoved off the ball anymore. Even his tackling seems to have improved a bit. Overall, there seems to be a different level of calmness and maturity about him.
 

redanddread

The stone that the builders refuse
outlaw_member said:
You should never play the offside trap, if the opponent ball carrier isn't sufficiently pressured. It was incredibly risky of Djourou to step up in that situation, but he did time it correctly. It was Gibbs who wandered backwards into playing Keane onside, or seemingly so for the linesman. Not to mention that Gibbs was at fault again for the exact same careless positioning, later on. Also, I'm very surprised at the number of high ratings he has received. Although, he was impressive offensively, I didn't see an outstanding performance warranting an 8. It's not like he got a couple of assists, or had some great offensive or defensive play. Even attacking wise, he was cutting inside far too often, and barely provided any purposeful width. If Clichy had made those mistakes, somehow I think the reaction would have been different.


Hmmmm.

Keane was offside. But the offside trap regardless is a risky but effective tool in the defensive armoury. What makes it so risky is that there is so little consistency in the officiating. Djourou was rusty and probably his decision making was also. Still Fabianksi SHOULD have saved that!

Gibbs played very well but not sure if he is defensively adroit as Clichy yet. He has the tools though.
 

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