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Squad Analysis

patrick42uk

Established Member
In terms of upfront there is only 2 players that remotely look like first teamers, rvp and ade. the question is, how many more strikers do we need and also how many do you think wenger will buy? what role can theo and bendtner play? can they realistically fill a gap?

With the sale of henry, there is the danger of focusing too much on the front position, but lets not forget that there is still that deficiency in terms depth on the wings. the questions in this regard would be; will wenger sign another winger? what role does walcott play? is hleb, rosicky, freddie and theo enough?

I think there is potentially an opportunity for wenger to show his strength in signing offensive players because IMO we'll need at least 2-3 wingers/forwards now. But i also fear it might be a case again of wenger placing too much faith on young players not ready for the responsibility.
 

Dez

Well-Known Member
This is interesting, I think another winger is certainly needed whether or not Freddie goes. Reyes could fill this whole but frankly hes a ****wit. Babel is another possibility in this position, this position need not necessarily be world class now. Whether we need another striker depends on a few things, and also whether we need a striker or a bergkamp style player in the whole is the other question.
If Vela returns then theoretically we are set for strikers. So if we have vela and Reyes return wehave a squad i am content with numbers wise, however in saying this quality might be an issue. But both Vela nad Bendtner are highly rated. I agree with your perseption of us needing 2-3 forwards but loanees returning could account for this.

Alternatively our current squad would best be suited to a 4-5-1

Eboue Toure Gallas Clichy
------------Gilberto--------------
--------Denilson-Cesc--------
Hleb-------------------Rosicky
-------------RVP-----------------

In which case we are in need of a central midfielder assuming Flamini leaves for back up to Gilberto. Though Song could do this, im not fully convinced. That team above is of huge quality but the squad itself lacks depth as the second 11 of

Hoyte-Djourou-Senderos-Traore
-------------Song-Diaby--------------
Walcott-------------------Ljungberg
--------Bendtner-Adebayor---------

lacks the absolute quality hat we had coming off the bench in 03/04 which hither after all squads will always be compared to. Back then we had awesome players coming off the bench, to a point where the second team could have put a strong challenge to the title.

Regardless back to what we need, it relies on what the plans for Walcott are and what formation we want to play. If i were greedy id say left back central midfield wing and a striker, but realistically one "forward" is what we will probably get.
 

Clrnc

Established Member
Trusted ⭐

Player:Tomiyasu
2 more winger. 1 more striker. then it will be very very good, more than capable of coping the loss of henry.

of course one of the 2 winger must also know how to play striker. if the worst case scenario, then buy 1 striker 1 winger. thats all
 

dos1986

Established Member
We lack alot imo....we need a dominating Centre Back because kolo and gallas are too small,we need proper cover for Cesc and Gilberto because a longterm injury to either of them and we are ****ed...Denilson is still a kid who cant play 7 consecutive games and Diaby is a liability alongside Cesc and isnt good enough yet to play alongside Gilberto for a sustained period...

We need at least one winger and 2 strikers too...
 

sabret00the

Established Member
I've been harping on about this for a while now. I believe the balance is wrong. I believe that before we buy we should sell. I believe we should rip apart the current squad in a bid to thrust forward.

Gallas, Ljungberg, Rosicky and Adebayor should be the sacrifices made in order to obtain balance in the squad. Once we have a balanced squad, we're able to slip practically any striker into our team and have them achieve as they would've done in weaker leagues.

* Gallas <=> Alex-esque defender.
* Ljungberg <=> Young true winger.
* Rosicky <=> Experienced winger, preferably goal savvy.
* Adebayor <=> Make weight for better striking options.
 

entropy13

Established Member
sabret00the said:
I've been harping on about this for a while now. I believe the balance is wrong. I believe that before we buy we should sell. I believe we should rip apart the current squad in a bid to thrust forward.

Gallas, Ljungberg, Rosicky and Adebayor should be the sacrifices made in order to obtain balance in the squad. Once we have a balanced squad, we're able to slip practically any striker into our team and have them achieve as they would've done in weaker leagues.

* Gallas <=> Alex-esque defender.
* Ljungberg <=> Young true winger.
* Rosicky <=> Experienced winger, preferably goal savvy.
* Adebayor <=> Make weight for better striking options.

Great, now we need a major overhaul! :roll:
 

YeahBee

Terrible hot takes
I really think reyes is going to stay with us, if he matures and gets a stabile start to the season he could be very good for us IMO, both playing on the left or up front with Ade

When he was good he was brilliant

I still want to see Baptista succed aswell, we still have the option right? is he still here or back at real? Holiday?
 

entropy13

Established Member
YeahBee said:
I really think reyes is going to stay with us, if he matures and gets a stabile start to the season he could be very good for us IMO, both playing on the left or up front with Ade

When he was good he was brilliant

I still want to see Baptista succed aswell, we still have the option right? is he still here or back at real? Holiday?

He's still technically on loan to us, just like Reyes is still with Real. Their loan spells end on June 30.
 

YeahBee

Terrible hot takes
good to know, maybe an extension?

anybody got a link to that vid with our three brazilians? I loved that one :)
 

sabret00the

Established Member
entropy13 said:
sabret00the said:
I've been harping on about this for a while now. I believe the balance is wrong. I believe that before we buy we should sell. I believe we should rip apart the current squad in a bid to thrust forward.

Gallas, Ljungberg, Rosicky and Adebayor should be the sacrifices made in order to obtain balance in the squad. Once we have a balanced squad, we're able to slip practically any striker into our team and have them achieve as they would've done in weaker leagues.

* Gallas <=> Alex-esque defender.
* Ljungberg <=> Young true winger.
* Rosicky <=> Experienced winger, preferably goal savvy.
* Adebayor <=> Make weight for better striking options.

Great, now we need a major overhaul! :roll:
how is it a major overhaul. freddie never plays, rosicky is only fit half the time and gallas just got here, not to mention toure's more in sync with the rest of the squad. oh and adebayor isn't exactly adept to coming off the bench and being proficient which makes him a ****e third choice.

you're replacing two players from the first team, three if you include henry and you restore balance and harmony.
 

sabret00the

Established Member
YeahBee said:
good to know, maybe an extension?

anybody got a link to that vid with our three brazilians? I loved that one :)
Did you bang your head in your absence from us? If Baptista never touches an Arsenal shirt ever again it'll be too soon. Wanting someone to succeed is not enough. He's not good enough.
 

entropy13

Established Member
sabret00the said:
how is it a major overhaul. freddie never plays, rosicky is only fit half the time and gallas just got here, not to mention toure's more in sync with the rest of the squad. oh and adebayor isn't exactly adept to coming off the bench and being proficient which makes him a s***e third choice.

you're replacing two players from the first team, three if you include henry and you restore balance and harmony.

Gallas just got here, and his replacement will not be a "just got here"? And Ade's replacement would be a super sub? Why would he leave his club, where he's most probably first-choice to replace our "s***e third choice"?

And Rosicky, although not initially a winger, is certainly experienced. If he turns out to be a great winger, why get a replacement for him now then? Simply because he's injury-prone? He shouldn't have been bought in the first place, is that what you're saying?

If the balance is indeed wrong, it seems you're pretty certain that the changes you propose would make it right. However, there's really no such thing as "absolute restoration" of the balance you mention. And perhaps you conveniently do not state that this change may or may not even take an effect immediately, heck may not even have an effect at all, or worse, it does have an effect, but for the detriment of the "balance"?
 

Big Poppa

Established Member
Trusted ⭐

Country: USA

Player:Saliba
sabret00the said:
I've been harping on about this for a while now. I believe the balance is wrong. I believe that before we buy we should sell. I believe we should rip apart the current squad in a bid to thrust forward.

Gallas, Ljungberg, Rosicky and Adebayor should be the sacrifices made in order to obtain balance in the squad. Once we have a balanced squad, we're able to slip practically any striker into our team and have them achieve as they would've done in weaker leagues.

* Gallas <=> Alex-esque defender.
* Ljungberg <=> Young true winger.
* Rosicky <=> Experienced winger, preferably goal savvy.
* Adebayor <=> Make weight for better striking options.

Be very careful Sabre. I think your underpinning theory has some validity - but you are dismissing the potential ramifications that come with such actions.

While it may be easy to conjure up a definitive list of players whom you want rid, I've noticed that there's considerably more ambiguity surrounding the ones you can get in to replace them.

There are no footballers that go around carrying the label 'Alexe-esque defender' and there are none that advertise themselves as a 'goal-savvy winger'. This is not a computer game where player carry descriptions of their profile on a database. Even scouts get it wrong sometimes. Indeed, a player that looks like something in one environment may look like something completely different in another.

Sometimes all you need is stability and continuity. If not, then uncertainty will continue to manifest and nobody will really be able to settle and improve. We have the makings of a very very good side. Ripping it apart and starting afresh is effectively repeating what we have done since 2004 again.

In terms of people leaving - that change has already happened, we've endured it and now it's time for the dust to settle. Nobody else should be allowed to leave. New players may come in to strengthen us but no more should go. This would be counter-productive and set us back even further.
 

Captain

Established Member
Barring Freddie, selling those players is completely counter-productive. The squad lacks depth as it is; we need to add to what we have, not replace.

There's little point having balance without quality in depth; your suggestions would truely make us a top six club at best.
 

YeahBee

Terrible hot takes
sabret00the said:
YeahBee said:
good to know, maybe an extension?

anybody got a link to that vid with our three brazilians? I loved that one :)
Did you bang your head in your absence from us? If Baptista never touches an Arsenal shirt ever again it'll be too soon. Wanting someone to succeed is not enough. He's not good enough.

Well yeah I did bang my head, I have been boxing for close to 6 months now, dammit my coach is picking me apart every day in sparring, I have a nasty habit of blocking the punches with my head :lol: :lol:

He has the skill, you can't deny it, he hasn't showed us that but... and his skills are unique to the team, his versaitily can come in handy aswell

he scored some goals and wasn't totally useless
 

clockwork orange

Blind faith in "LVG filoshophy"
patrick42uk said:
In terms of upfront there is only 2 players that remotely look like first teamers, rvp and ade. the question is, how many more strikers do we need and also how many do you think wenger will buy?
Wenger will buy one striker (unless Ade or Bendtner moves elsewhere). That's fine as long as it's a certified damn good one. Ade& Nick are still young, they could improve rapidly (I expect Bendtner to do well), but we're not sure about that.
Hope that 1 striker will be an out and out striker (would be best partner for Robin), or can play like that, I mean a guy who is at the near post or the penalty spot when he should. Would go for a very good header of the ball (makes wingers far more dangerous).

Maybe we get a 2nd one disguised as a winger. Hope we'll get a player like that, say a Tevez, would be a knife that's cuts both ways could give us width & could play upfront.

patrick42uk said:
what role can theo and bendtner play? can they realistically fill a gap?
Think they both have the ability to be a starter for us at some point in time. Could be as of the start of this season. They're certainly good enough to be very useful subs this season. We'll see.

patrick42uk said:
With the sale of henry, there is the danger of focusing too much on the front position, but lets not forget that there is still that deficiency in terms depth on the wings. the questions in this regard would be; will wenger sign another winger?
I hope he signs 2 players who can really play like a winger. Finally we have a very wide pitch, which is great for a team playing a passing game like us. We didn't use the full width of the pitch last season, we should. As we call it in Holland, two of our players should eat chalk, i.e. keep play dogmatically wide. In this way we'll spread out the back 4 as far as possible creating space for our midiielders. This is what we need against parked busses or when we're 0-1 down in a top match.

Hleb and Rosicky are no wingers. Theo is, but that's not enough.So unless somebody from Academy Reserves dramatically improves, I'ld go for 2 wingers. If they can play as striker too, that would be a bonus.

We do not always have to play with wingers we can also start with a narrower midifeld with Hleb & Rosicky, but we should have another option. Tactically we've been far too 1-dimensional last season.

patrick42uk said:
what role does walcott play?
Be 1 of the wingers and get playing time depending on his progress.


patrick42uk said:
is hleb, rosicky, freddie and theo enough?
Nope

patrick42uk said:
I think there is potentially an opportunity for wenger to show his strength in signing offensive players because IMO we'll need at least 2-3 wingers/forwards now. But i also fear it might be a case again of wenger placing too much faith on young players not ready for the responsibility.
I'ld go for that too.

All signings (even the wingers) should be 10+ goalscorers. We lack proven goalscoring capacity. I wouldn't feel confident at all if we start with any of the line-ups Dez suggested. Those players all could start for us, but in an EPL/CL winning team (that's is what we always should go for) you need at least 3 10+ goalscorers otherwise it's too easy to cut of supply to your finishers.

My signings would be:

winger (sub): Babel 6M
winger/striker: Tevez 25M ??
striker: Klose: 10M (unfortunately he's 29, so Wenger will not go for him)
 

patrick42uk

Established Member
stability is way too important to wenger. freddie might go as might flamini but these are dead wood. stability will be the foundation as it always is. BUT, and i thik everyone appreciates this from last season, we needed something to close the gap between us and chelsea/man utd. i expected this summer to be like the summer we saw that flurry of actibvity with inamoto, jeffers, canpbell, gio e.t.c all signing. with the sale of henry, and the cash it releases, i'm 100% convinced now that we wont see anything less than 3 new signings.

if you look at everybody's expectations for arsenal this, its 3rd or fourth because nobody felt truly convinced that we would do what was needed in the market to take the extra step. henry's sale and the financial consequence of that opens it all up. i'v got this strong feeling that wenger has a plan. or maybe its more hope. its strange to say this, but i feel far more confident about this season now than i did before the henry sale.
 

JonBoy10

Member
I don't think we need to sell anyone in our squad except Freddie and Flamini. Freddie because of his astronomical wages vs value ratio, and Flamini because he wants to leave and frankly has never really cut the mustard in central-midfield for us.

But there are a few areas where we need more options. In central-defense we have two fast, mobile, positionally aware defenders, and two potentially great, inexperienced defenders. But what we don't have is a defender who can dominate a striker on the ground and in the air. Against PSv in the UCL last season I was pretty much in awe of the way Alex defended, I haven't been that impressed in years. Of course anyone can do that for two games, but the sentiment still applies.

In central-midfield we still need a box-to-box, ball winning, powerful midfielder who will fly into a tackle and inspire the team to victory. Neither Gilberto, Diaby, Fabregas or Denilson offer us that. I'm not sure what Diaby offers us exactly. He has good dribbling skills, is a decent tackler, but he doesn't offer us enough defensively or offensively. Denilson is the opposite, he can spot a pass and does defend well, but he's a bit too small to be the main defensive option at the moment, and is a bit too similar to Fabregas. Gilberto is fantastic at what he does, there's no better defensive midfielder in the league I dare-say. BUT he doesn't offer us hardly anything offensively from open play, and I don't think we can afford to have only one central-midfielder who creates for us. In all our previous midfield partnerships, both players have offered us a bit of a creative spark.

We clearly need more options on the wing, we have noone to go down the outside on the left and whip in a cross, and whilst that's fine, because we don't play that way anyway, but we need that option so that it allows more space infield for the others to run into. If a defender can guarentee you're going on the inside, then he can shut off the space with no worries of anyone going down the outside. That's where Clichy is supposed to come in, but he doesn't get forward quite as much as Cole did, and he will need to practise his crossing aswell.

Up-front we obviously need to bring in a bit of experience and quality. Adebayor won't get us enough goals and van Persie is always likely to miss a few games through injury. Bendtner is totally unproven in the Premiership, as is Walcott. But Bendtner can offer us something we don't have, he can play target-man or he can play the Bergkamp role effectively. Walcott is the key man though, I just think he could explode once he gets some confidence. There's no question in my mind he has every attribute he needs to become a top quality striker, the only thing he's lacking is a bit of strength, which thankfully he can add over time.

Overall it's clear to me that we need to sign a minimum of two players - a winger and a striker. The two most likely candidates are clearly Babel and Anelka, but I'd also like to us to sign someone like Naldo from Werder Bremen, and send Djourou out on loan for a season.

If we can bring in quality in those positions, then I genuinely beleive we can win a major trophy this year. I'm sure that Henry leaving will be proved a master-stroke.
 

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