Kai Havertz: No More Mr Nice Kai

[Blankety Blank]

Szoboszlai cost 60 million pounds (he had a release clause), has been worse than Havertz, and some Liverpool fans want him out already.

I wanted Havertz over Szoboszlai, the receipts are there.

Szob has been a strange one coz there are times when he looks class on the ball ( certainly a more natural AM than Kai) but he has not produced enough.

I definitely think we were better getting Havertz rather than a more specialised AM last summer due to his versatility.

As said. I think we would have struggled to keep pace with City without him as an option more up top this season.

 

[PrinzPoldi]

Szob has been a strange one coz there are times when he looks class on the ball ( certainly a more natural AM than Kai) but he has not produced enough.

I definitely think we were better getting Havertz rather than a more specialised AM last summer due to his versatility.

As said. I think we would have struggled to keep pace with City without him as an option more up top this season.

Instead of (still) questioning why we bought Kai and how much we spent (wasted) on him, people should be grateful that everything seems good so far.

He did contribute a lot since November as one of the most important players to take us to this position.

We will buy another striker for next season or not, that is next season.
Embrace what we have NOW.

Whining and complaining like a b1tch is really shallow.

 

[HighburyHigh]

I like this version of Kai. We'd miss him if he wasn't in the team big time.

 

[grange]

You guys are doing that thing where you start calling players world class when they're not really world class.

Exceptional? Sure. World Class potential? Definitely. But we don't have any trully world class players.

At most, you should be adding the attribute. Rice is a world class ball winner, but is he a world class player?

Not really.

If the argument is going to be that various leagues in Europe are much easier than years past then the bar for being world class players has also lowered.

We're going to need the nostalgia merchants like Gary to reconcile how much leagues have dropped in quality then correlate that to an arbitrary measurement when it comes to judging world class players in this current state.

The technical quality certainly has dipped but the conditioning requirements for modern top teams has raised significantly which also puts players in more danger of injury. Comparing eras doesn't really work here as people just want to moan about the good ol days whereas they haven't provided an accurate measurement to determine if I should agree with their takes.

That being said, R9 clears all.

 

[Batman]

That being said, R9 clears all.

 

[jaystewart]

When 'world class' players don't turn up in the most important games, then there are not world class.

This metric 'world class' is overstated and overused.

Arsenal have 0 world class players. Saliba may be class in the Prem but has been poor in Europe.

You're right, Ødegaard isn't world class. Ødegaard is generational. He isn't on par with Pele, Maradonna and Messi yet but he's young. At the moment he is generational like Modric, Zidane ect When he dominates a big game for the first time he will ascend and sit amongst the greatest.

 

[El Duderino]

If the argument is going to be that various leagues in Europe are much easier than years past then the bar for being world class players has also lowered.

We're going to need the nostalgia merchants like Gary to reconcile how much leagues have dropped in quality then correlate that to an arbitrary measurement when it comes to judging world class players in this current state.

The technical quality certainly has dipped but the conditioning requirements for modern top teams has raised significantly which also puts players in more danger of injury. Comparing eras doesn't really work here as people just want to moan about the good ol days whereas they haven't provided an accurate measurement to determine if I should agree with their takes.

That being said, R9 clears all.

I mean, the standards are still the standards. A world class player doesn't really care about leagues being weaker or not.

And yes, R9 does clear.

 

[lufere7]

We should have a thread where we define the term World Class collectively as a forum and ban anyone that uses any other definition, we all just talk past each other every time the conversation comes up

For the record I'm in the "be a top 3 player in your position for a sustained amount of time" camp. So I would think guys like Ode, Saka and Saliba just have the sustained amount part to prove at this point if anything.

My approach certainly has flaws, like Saka almost gets it by default with how poor the RW market is, or it's hard to compare between leagues and maybe we overrate the PL a bit, but I think it's just a matter of adjusting parameters. On the other hand trying to compare between generations is too prone to nostalgia for me, or to rating attributes that are not coveted by the top teams at the moment.

 

[fute]

World class is only for a handful of players in the world. Not the PL. Not the CL. The world.

You know them when you see them on the pitch. They do the unthinkable. No amount of strategy or tactics can account for them. You just hope they have a bad day.

Fans who love their club, wishfully like to put their favorite players on that World Class level. Particularly, after they have a good game.

We don't have any world class players.

We have quite a few good players who play great at times. Ødegaard has been exceptional recently.

 

[ArsenesCoatMaker]

This season playing as a CF in EPL without penalties, he has a point per 61,5 minutes. Which is levels of output we have seen only from the likes of Henry and Van Persie.

I think I counted 8 starts as a 9 in the PL so far and he has 6 goals and 3 assists in that position. So not quite a point per 61.5 but very good. However his CL and FA Cup no9 starts make him 003

 

[lufere7]

World class is only for a handful of players in the world. Not the PL. Not the CL. The world.

You know them when you see them on the pitch. They do the unthinkable. No amount of strategy or tactics can account for them. You just hope they have a bad day.

Fans who love their club, wishfully like to put their favorite players on that World Class level. Particularly, after they have a good game.

We don't have any world class players.

We have quite a few good players who play great at times. Ødegaard has been exceptional recently.

Again, that's just your definition. And it seems terribly biased towards attacking players for me, Rodri is certifiably world class, yet I never see him do "the unthinkable'" or be unstoppable, he's just the best in the world at what he's tasked to do, same with defenders.

 

[DJ_Markstar]

GDeep is famous for calling Ødegaard Casper the Ghost. And has been proven totally wrong.

Of course he hates him.

Ironically it’s Gary who tends to ghost when he’s shown to be wrong or loses a bet or whatever

 

[2Smokeyy]

The way people have shifted away from rating Saka so highly is funny. He’s still one of our most important players, don’t let rival fans fool you.

 

[RunTheTrap]

The way people have shifted away from rating Saka so highly is funny. He’s still one of our most important players, don’t let rival fans fool you.

He literally saved us from Pepe and is the poster boy of Arsenal's resurgence. People are disrespecting him for Kai Havertz! La Hawla.

 

[samspade]

The way people have shifted away from rating Saka so highly is funny. He’s still one of our most important players, don’t let rival fans fool you.

Saka's incredible and AM is stupid. Bloke can't finish tho, right @Trilly

 

[samspade]

He literally saved us from Pepe and is the poster boy of Arsenal's resurgence. People are disrespecting him for Kai Havertz! La Hawla.

People just need to relax, great players have dips, it happens. Salah's stinking up the place atm by all accounts

 

[samspade]

We need more time to see what Havertz will be, he's been doing new things as the months have worn on. I think it's pretty clear that it's still an evolving situation. His connections with team mates show a lot of potential

 

[Trilly]

Saka's incredible and AM is stupid. Bloke can't finish tho, right @Trilly

What’s going on here?

You’ve come back from a break, using jokes from before your sabbatical. Come on

 

[drippin]

When 'world class' players don't turn up in the most important games, then there are not world class.

This metric 'world class' is overstated and overused.

Arsenal have 0 world class players. Saliba may be class in the Prem but has been poor in Europe.

You didn't understand my point, and I didn't say any Arsenal player is world class in my post. I'm not going there, because everyone seems to have a different meaning for that definition.

I said that even world class players don't perform 10/10 in every game. And that you don't know football if you think so.

And Ødegaard has to be given some slack compared to the likes of Özil and such, who didn't press and defend as well, so they could focus more on the attack and were fresh to attack. In the past these kind of players were more usual, so of course they looked better when attacking. Fatique affects every action a lot.

 

[drippin]

I think I counted 8 starts as a 9 in the PL so far and he has 6 goals and 3 assists in that position. So not quite a point per 61.5 but very good. However his CL and FA Cup no9 starts make him 003

How did you count them? Even if a player starts, it doesn't mean he plays 90 minutes. And he can come from the bench.

Did you go through all the games in Transfermarkt, or what? Why do you count it like this, when Transfermarkt gives you total minutes in any competition, and you can count them easily from there?

In EPL it's 678 minutes as a CF, having 6+5=11 without penalties.

Kai Havertz - Detailed stats

These are the detailed performance data of FC Arsenal player Kai Havertz. The website contains a statistic about the performance data of the player.

www.transfermarkt.com