Premier League | Stoke City vs Arsenal | 19/08/2017 | 17:30 BST (16:30 UTC) | BT Sport

[Rocky]

Where was Per?

On the bench

 

[Trilly]

Finding out that Mertesacker, Holding and Chambers were available has made me much more critical of Wenger for this loss.

 

[rich 1990]

Finding out that Mertesacker, Holding and Chambers were available has made me much more critical of Wenger for this loss.

Still would have lost the way we were attacking. I know the defence was **** but we weren't scoring 2 even if we were still playing now. Wenger's responsible for all losses.

 

[tcahill]

Still would have lost the way we were attacking. I know the defence was **** but we weren't scoring 2 even if we were still playing now. Wenger's responsible for all losses.

In both this game and the Leicester game I thought we attacked very well. Welbeck should of put away at least two, Bellerin one and maybe gotten us a pen too, Lacazette's ripper, Ramsey had two good chances, Giroud's half chance etc.

 

[Trilly]

You're slowly turning into the voice of reason on this forum.

People will somehow contrive everything to be about Wenger, misplaced passes, injuries, suspensions, strikers missing simple chances, referees missing penalties, linesmen disallowing goals that would have stood in any other match.

The truth was simple, we played no where near as well as we did againgst Cheksea in the Cup, some players were below par today but we were much better than Stoke and if there was any justice the game should have been at least a draw. The officiating was really poor and we squandered chances.

Have to say though that we definitely should have done better. I don't want to defend Wenger because he's the one who fielded a crazy starting eleven and continues to allow Ramsey to charge forward to the detriment of the team.

 

[bingobob]

OK if you can hold up that FACup card for the squad, what about Wenger? If his tactics are good enough to easily outplay Chelsea twice, how can they suddenly be rubbish for Stoke.

Can't have it both ways.

I don't think I said he was rubbish in fairness. But since you raised the point we had two left full backs playing centre back and had a rb playing at left back. Like seriously wtf is that all about?

As @Trilly said the loss is made worse knowing we had four fit and available centre backs and still elected to go with this make shift shambles. What's the point in having the squad if it isn't used?

 

[Kwaku]

Uhhhh did you not listen to what Kroenke himself said about what the club's expectations are when Arséne re-signed?



I don't know how much more candid you can get than that.

Kroenke has also said so

Uhhhh did you not listen to what Kroenke himself said about what the club's expectations are when Arséne re-signed?



I don't know how much more candid you can get than that.

People at Arsenal say a lot of things to be honest, I just prefer to go by the actions I see. Winning the Premier League could be an ambition of the club but they cannot convince me that they are doing whatever they can to achieve this when they do something like give Wenger a two year extension for example.

Kroenke is the same guy that said

"If you want to win championships then you would never get involved. I think the best owners in sports are the guys that sort of watch both sides a bit. If you don't have a good business then you can't really afford to go out and get the best players unless you just want to rely on other sources of income."

 

[Big Poppa]

We basically need a player who can run a midfield. It was once Fabregas. Then it was Cazorla. Now we have no-one.

Curious about your definition of running midfield. To me it has to include winning battles. Vieira was the last Arsenal player I saw doing that consistently and against the best.

 

[Gooner Zig]

Kroenke has also said so


People at Arsenal say a lot of things to be honest, I just prefer to go by the actions I see. Winning the Premier League could be an ambition of the club but they cannot convince me that they are doing whatever they can to achieve this when they do something like give Wenger a two year extension for example.

Kroenke is the same guy that said

"If you want to win championships then you would never get involved. I think the best owners in sports are the guys that sort of watch both sides a bit. If you don't have a good business then you can't really afford to go out and get the best players unless you just want to rely on other sources of income."

Your point was that fans should readjust their expectations. My counter is that the Arsène, Gazidis, Kroenke, everyone associated with the club continues to make definitive statements that our ambition/goal is to win the PL and compete in Europe. Are you suggesting that the fan base not take these comments at face value?

This is why people go mental when we continually don't do enough to properly compete. The club charges one of the highest ticket prices in the world, sets the expectations that the team is there to win the PL and compete in Europe and when we get no where near our targets, act all surprised at why the fan base is pissed off.

 

[Makingtrax]

I don't think I said he was rubbish in fairness. But since you raised the point we had two left full backs playing centre back and had a rb playing at left back. Like seriously wtf is that all about?

As @Trilly said the loss is made worse knowing we had four fit and available centre backs and still elected to go with this make shift shambles. What's the point in having the squad if it isn't used?

Mertersaker was clearly benched and not fit enough to start, Gabriel injured, Kos suspended, leaves the 2 young lads to play alongside Mustafi. Holding made a few errors last week and Wenger sees them all in training.

Conte played David Luiz out of position and he'll be praised because they won. Had Lacazette's goal stood and the penalty seen by Mariner, we wouldn't even be having this conversation.

Football managers exist on a knife edge.

 

[Sniper Mik]

Your point was that fans should readjust their expectations. My counter is that the Arséne, Gazidis, Kroenke, everyone associated with the club continues to make definitive statements that our ambition/goal is to win the PL and compete in Europe. Are you suggesting that the fan base not take these comments at face value?

This is why people go mental when we continually don't do enough to properly compete. The club charges one of the highest ticket prices in the world, sets the expectations that the team is there to win the PL and compete in Europe and when we get no where near our targets, act all surprised at why the fan base is pissed off.

Well said

 

[Mrs Bergkamp]

Mertersaker was clearly benched and not fit enough to start, Gabriel injured, Kos suspended, leaves the 2 young lads to play alongside Mustafi. Holding made a few errors last week and Wenger sees them all in training.

Conte played David Luiz out of position and he'll be praised because they won. Had Lacazette's goal stood and the penalty seen by Mariner, we wouldn't even be having this conversation.

Football managers exist on a knife edge.

Agree with you on this one. ATM,we have Kos and Mustafi as the only experienced CB's at the club who might be able to play every game and even Kos' fitness is suspect. We need to rebuild CB but that's for another transfer window

 

[Mrs Bergkamp]

Your point was that fans should readjust their expectations. My counter is that the Arséne, Gazidis, Kroenke, everyone associated with the club continues to make definitive statements that our ambition/goal is to win the PL and compete in Europe. Are you suggesting that the fan base not take these comments at face value?

This is why people go mental when we continually don't do enough to properly compete. The club charges one of the highest ticket prices in the world, sets the expectations that the team is there to win the PL and compete in Europe and when we get no where near our targets, act all surprised at why the fan base is pissed off.

The board need to adjust their main expectation that they can keep mugging off the fans.

 

[Makingtrax]

Your point was that fans should readjust their expectations. My counter is that the Arséne, Gazidis, Kroenke, everyone associated with the club continues to make definitive statements that our ambition/goal is to win the PL and compete in Europe. Are you suggesting that the fan base not take these comments at face value?

This is why people go mental when we continually don't do enough to properly compete. The club charges one of the highest ticket prices in the world, sets the expectations that the team is there to win the PL and compete in Europe and when we get no where near our targets, act all surprised at why the fan base is pissed off.

Absolutely naive stuff. They're setting themselves up for a fall every time they do this. They talk like Barca and spend like Liverpool.

 

[gonner4life23]

How can Arsène justify playing one of his main signings this summer(Kolasinac) out of position in his first three games at the club. What must this guy be thinking, it is beggars belief. Just play players in their right positions for god sake. The guy is not a centre back and he was in the team of the season in the bundesliga. Wengers just giving the fans ammo time and time again and fueling the flames for negaitivity with his outrageous decisions.

 

[bingobob]

Mertersaker was clearly benched and not fit enough to start, Gabriel injured, Kos suspended, leaves the 2 young lads to play alongside Mustafi. Holding made a few errors last week and Wenger sees them all in training.

Conte played David Luiz out of position and he'll be praised because they won. Had Lacazette's goal stood and the penalty seen by Mariner, we wouldn't even be having this conversation.

Football managers exist on a knife edge.

And if the Luiz move never worked he'd be slated for it.

The fact we just got by Leicester with four full backs should have been enough to make him adopt. He didn't. Like you said it a knife edge and those decisions when they don't pay off will be scrutinised.

 

[Makingtrax]

And if the Luiz move never worked he'd be slated for it..

But he's still a very good manager whatever people would have said

 

[TakeChillPill]

Still believe an el neny and Xhaka partnership would've made us far more stable. Love ramesy, but he's been terrific as an impact sub...but with him in the team we lose a lot of cohesion

 

[tap-in]

How can Arséne justify playing one of his main signings this summer(Kolasinac) out of position in his first three games at the club. What must this guy be thinking, it is beggars belief. Just play players in their right positions for god sake. The guy is not a centre back and he was in the team of the season in the bundesliga. Wengers just giving the fans ammo time and time again and fueling the flames for negaitivity with his outrageous decisions.

Agreed, I said before the game that I was looking forward to seeing Kolasinac at LWB. I thought even if Per doesn't play he would go Holding, Mustafi, Monreal. No chance! It really is these kind of lunatic mindboggling decisions that have turned me against Wenger in the last 2 seasons. Playing Welbeck yet again rather than Iwobi was another issue for me. As for Bellerin at LWB, why? does he really see Kolasinac as a CB and thought he should find another LWB within, or was he worried about dropping one of Bellerin or OX, ie not wanting to upset either of them. I have no idea but I do know these decisions make little sense to me and many others.

 

[gonner4life23]

Agreed, I said before the game that I was looking forward to seeing Kolasinac at LWB. I thought even if Per doesn't play he would go Holding, Mustafi, Monreal. No chance! It really is these kind of lunatic mindboggling decisions that have turned me against Wenger in the last 2 seasons. Playing Welbeck yet again rather than Iwobi was another issue for me. As for Bellerin at LWB, why? does he really see Kolasinac as a CB and thought he should find another LWB within, or was he worried about dropping one of Bellerin or OX, ie not wanting to upset either of them. I have no idea but I do know these decisions make little sense to me and many others.

Wenger treats the fans and club like his own play toy!! Playing players out of position like this is what amateur Sunday teams do. We are a professional outfit that turns over millions of pounds and we can't even field a team of players in their correct positions. We are getting laughed at and it's all Wengers fault.