Jbruin
Established Member
Cazorla set up the best chance of the game...
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EPL – Arsenal vs Sunderland – 3pm – 18/8/12 - Arsenal Player
- Thread starter ferrarif50hunt
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redanddread
The stone that the builders refuse
ArseneKnows-47 said:
Nobody is happy at today's result but don't think it was down to individual errors or weaknesses but rather the team was not in sync , particularly in the attacking 3rd.
Quite how Jenkinson is a liability after one game where we had very little defending to do and what he did he did well and how can you be running out of patience with Diaby when the dude just returned form injury are two observations quite beyond me. Gervinho was one of our best players today and although one of your fellow moaners has posted stats re the number of times he lost possession he offered a different threat and was responsible for many attacking situations for us-particularly in the 2nd 1/2. Quite how people come to these extreme conclusions after one game is unfathomable.
If you are going to join the chorus of boo boys on the site here then at least make some sense with your arguments.
rednwhitearmy
Resident Noob
Jbruin said:
Gervinho was great, I thought. He was our only wide threat all day, and did some amazing runs.
It's the first game of the season. Everyone needs to stop getting so angry.
The only thing we learnt so far is that Jenkinson doesn't quite seem ready to tackle Premier League football as yet (it will come), and Ramsey still hasn't got his touch back (but he was just at the Olympics, so maybe i was fatigue).
We'll just have to wait and see.
arsenalfc0719
Established Member
you lose possession 25 times, and your a complete liability and thats what Gerv is. He flatters to deceive people who are impressed with him getting past the right back, but don't see past that, as nothing good came from any of his work today except one pass to Cazorla.
1 good thing all game is simply not enough, especially considering all the bad things, like losing possession 25 times.
1 good thing all game is simply not enough, especially considering all the bad things, like losing possession 25 times.
redanddread
The stone that the builders refuse
arsenalfc0719 said:
Think what you want, it's a democracy. Shame he was guilty of those "bad things".
Alkesh
Active Member
I liked the look of Arshavin today. He was looked fit, and for the first time in a while, serious. I think he's a good option against teams that park the bus, or as an impact sub. I'm willing to give him a second chance.
Gervinho, I thought, looked decent today. He was clearly up for it, and was beating his man with consistency. There weren't too many people in the box for him, and I think the statistic of him giving away the ball had more to do with how aggressively he was being marked by the second half. He'll only get better, and I liked what he offered today.
Gervinho, I thought, looked decent today. He was clearly up for it, and was beating his man with consistency. There weren't too many people in the box for him, and I think the statistic of him giving away the ball had more to do with how aggressively he was being marked by the second half. He'll only get better, and I liked what he offered today.
Jenks was weird today, for someone who looks eager too impress and trying too hard, yesterday he looked like he was playing as safely as possible, not a bad thing considering his inexperience, but when we are in relative control of the game, you expect more from a FB that didn't need to track back for most of the 2nd half.
Country: Australia
Jbruin said:
Ah yes he did , Gerv set up the best chance in the first half then .
What pisses me off the most is... every time we play a **** team that just parks the bus, the commentators commend them for their "hard work"... why is it that nobody ever commends an attacking team for their hard work?
Attacking requires hard work, imagination, and taking risks. Defending requires just hard work. Why does defending receive so much praise in England?! What's with this stupid addiction to boring style of play in this country???
Attacking requires hard work, imagination, and taking risks. Defending requires just hard work. Why does defending receive so much praise in England?! What's with this stupid addiction to boring style of play in this country???
Le Titi
Active Member
perspolis said:
In principle I see what you mean, but at the end of the day why should our attacking display be praised after a 0-0 draw? In this case, Sunderland were the much more happy of the two teams.
It's also laughable that you think defending in the Premier League requires 'just hard work'
The Escaped Ape
Well-Known Member
Sheesh. I went straight to bed after the match yesterday (partly because I've been ill, partly because it was an underwhelming match and partly because, well, it was gone 1am by the time it finished here), but what a steaming pile of Arsenal-typical whinging and moaning. :roll:
I know not everyone's indulged in the pointless self-flagellation and pissy complaining, but it's depressing that so many are ready to write our players off so quickly based on one match.
Here are some mitigations for those that missed them.
1. It was incredibly hot yesterday. This was mentioned by the commentators countless times, so I assume it was hot enough to make a difference (35 degrees is enough to slow a game right down, working to Sunderland's advantage).
2. So many of our starters were not at Arsenal last season or played a very minor role in the final months of last season for injuries etc: Cazorla, Podolski, Giroud, Diaby, Arshavin, Jenkinson, Mertesacker, Arteta - leaving aside Giroud and Arshavin who came on as subs, that's over half the team who were not starting at the end of last season. Not really that surprising that it's not completely gelled yet.
3. We'd just sold RVP. A lot of people might have missed this development, but it's worth reminding yourself if you'd forgotten :roll:. Not necessarily just for his contribution, but for its impact on the dressing room. Couple that with Song leaving as well and you've got a recipe for a rather flat game.
4. Sunderland parked the bus, removed its wheels and lit a campfire. They had the occasional foray into our half to forage for food, but always looked like they were terrified of being caught stealing apples, so were straight back into their own half at the drop of a hat. Dribbling through an entire football team is quite tricky, to say the least.
5. Those players who people like to bash they will apparently bash no matter what. Diaby had a good game for a guy back from a season where he only made 5 appearances. Sure, he didn't change the game, but he presented real options and reminded us that he can create opportunities. He might still be a good option at times. He's not beautiful to watch, but does a job (if he stays uninjured). Gervinho actually showed a lot of resourcefulness and energy getting through the maze of blue shirts in the Sunderland area. Jenkinson, though I'd agree is not ready for the first team, at least showed a hell of a lot of energy and commitment and I think was getting a bit better towards the end.
Now for the real positives.
Cazorla - showed qualities that will serve well in the Premiership, including dealing with being target marked, finding team mates under pressure, creating chances out of nowhere etc and his frustration at not being able to convert chances looked real - he's going to be driven to succeed and I hope will have an influence over team dynamics through this.
Podolski - not match fit, or properly firing yet, but actually liked his energy and directness.
Vermaelen - seeing real signs that he's getting back to his best and I wonder if it's the new responsibility that's helping as well. I saw signs he was taking charge at times, which is promising.
Arteta. Mikel, it's good to have you back. I get a feeling of reassurance when the ball is with him. That is all.
Diaby - I'm going to get crucified for this, but it was a revelation for me to see that he could play football. He's not going to be a star player for us, clearly, but he could be useful and that in itself was news for me - I'd kind of assumed he'd just be Wenger's expensive paperweight this season, serving no good purpose, just reminding him of something from years back. He might be a useful squad player. I don't want him as a starter for many games, just as a useful back up if needed.
Concerns (yes, I had them - plenty of them)
Giroud - a Sp**s fan I work with is convinced Podolksi will be great for us but that Giroud is another Chamakh. I was dismissive of this before today. Now I'm not so sure. Sure it was his first PL match and only a sub appearance, but I was a bit concerned. I'm thinking he needs to be used with Podolski, not instead of.
Mertesacker - his reading of the game seemed good. A number of times he made crucial interceptions. But his role in building play from the back or participating in attack is alarming. Ungainly and awkward, looking like he could easily be dispossessed and not really judging well where to pass the ball. I'd like to be wrong, but at the moment I'm quite worried about him at no.3 CB.
Where are the goals going to come from? There are a number of players we know are capable of scoring multiple goals from their records (Giroud, Podolski, Walcott, Gervinho, Arteta and Arshavin). But at the moment, we've either got players who have lost their main strike partner (Walcott), look like they're passed their major goal-scoring years (Arshavin and maybe even Arteta) and a raft of new players who will need to start the tap flowing before we can start to rely on them (Giroud, Podolski, Gervinho). I suspect Wenger will spend a month or two experimenting with formations, which won't help the team bed down either.
Linked to this - confidence. We needed a win to help the team (virtually a new team) get this. We need a good, solid PL win soon to help build the right momentum.
Reasons to be optimistic:
Kos, the Ox, Rosicky and Sagna to come back soon. Wilshere to start making an impression in the latter half of the season I'm guessing.
Maybe a couple of new signings will help...?
I know not everyone's indulged in the pointless self-flagellation and pissy complaining, but it's depressing that so many are ready to write our players off so quickly based on one match.
Here are some mitigations for those that missed them.
1. It was incredibly hot yesterday. This was mentioned by the commentators countless times, so I assume it was hot enough to make a difference (35 degrees is enough to slow a game right down, working to Sunderland's advantage).
2. So many of our starters were not at Arsenal last season or played a very minor role in the final months of last season for injuries etc: Cazorla, Podolski, Giroud, Diaby, Arshavin, Jenkinson, Mertesacker, Arteta - leaving aside Giroud and Arshavin who came on as subs, that's over half the team who were not starting at the end of last season. Not really that surprising that it's not completely gelled yet.
3. We'd just sold RVP. A lot of people might have missed this development, but it's worth reminding yourself if you'd forgotten :roll:. Not necessarily just for his contribution, but for its impact on the dressing room. Couple that with Song leaving as well and you've got a recipe for a rather flat game.
4. Sunderland parked the bus, removed its wheels and lit a campfire. They had the occasional foray into our half to forage for food, but always looked like they were terrified of being caught stealing apples, so were straight back into their own half at the drop of a hat. Dribbling through an entire football team is quite tricky, to say the least.
5. Those players who people like to bash they will apparently bash no matter what. Diaby had a good game for a guy back from a season where he only made 5 appearances. Sure, he didn't change the game, but he presented real options and reminded us that he can create opportunities. He might still be a good option at times. He's not beautiful to watch, but does a job (if he stays uninjured). Gervinho actually showed a lot of resourcefulness and energy getting through the maze of blue shirts in the Sunderland area. Jenkinson, though I'd agree is not ready for the first team, at least showed a hell of a lot of energy and commitment and I think was getting a bit better towards the end.
Now for the real positives.
Cazorla - showed qualities that will serve well in the Premiership, including dealing with being target marked, finding team mates under pressure, creating chances out of nowhere etc and his frustration at not being able to convert chances looked real - he's going to be driven to succeed and I hope will have an influence over team dynamics through this.
Podolski - not match fit, or properly firing yet, but actually liked his energy and directness.
Vermaelen - seeing real signs that he's getting back to his best and I wonder if it's the new responsibility that's helping as well. I saw signs he was taking charge at times, which is promising.
Arteta. Mikel, it's good to have you back. I get a feeling of reassurance when the ball is with him. That is all.
Diaby - I'm going to get crucified for this, but it was a revelation for me to see that he could play football. He's not going to be a star player for us, clearly, but he could be useful and that in itself was news for me - I'd kind of assumed he'd just be Wenger's expensive paperweight this season, serving no good purpose, just reminding him of something from years back. He might be a useful squad player. I don't want him as a starter for many games, just as a useful back up if needed.
Concerns (yes, I had them - plenty of them)
Giroud - a Sp**s fan I work with is convinced Podolksi will be great for us but that Giroud is another Chamakh. I was dismissive of this before today. Now I'm not so sure. Sure it was his first PL match and only a sub appearance, but I was a bit concerned. I'm thinking he needs to be used with Podolski, not instead of.
Mertesacker - his reading of the game seemed good. A number of times he made crucial interceptions. But his role in building play from the back or participating in attack is alarming. Ungainly and awkward, looking like he could easily be dispossessed and not really judging well where to pass the ball. I'd like to be wrong, but at the moment I'm quite worried about him at no.3 CB.
Where are the goals going to come from? There are a number of players we know are capable of scoring multiple goals from their records (Giroud, Podolski, Walcott, Gervinho, Arteta and Arshavin). But at the moment, we've either got players who have lost their main strike partner (Walcott), look like they're passed their major goal-scoring years (Arshavin and maybe even Arteta) and a raft of new players who will need to start the tap flowing before we can start to rely on them (Giroud, Podolski, Gervinho). I suspect Wenger will spend a month or two experimenting with formations, which won't help the team bed down either.
Linked to this - confidence. We needed a win to help the team (virtually a new team) get this. We need a good, solid PL win soon to help build the right momentum.
Reasons to be optimistic:
Kos, the Ox, Rosicky and Sagna to come back soon. Wilshere to start making an impression in the latter half of the season I'm guessing.
Maybe a couple of new signings will help...?
dreamLord
Established Member
Our wing play is absolutely dire. No cut backs, no running onto the ball and whipping in crosses, just backward passes to either the FB or the midfield.
I wish Wenger would learn from United. Makes it so easy to score against teams that put 10 men behind the ball.
I wish Wenger would learn from United. Makes it so easy to score against teams that put 10 men behind the ball.
mavelous
Tinfoil hat aficionado
if we're jumping to conclusions based on first day, then pool are doomed to midtable irrelevance and tottenham look like they may not recover from the modric loss.
kopzilla
Always Negative
Surprised to see Arshavin still with us.I thought he was off to Galatasaray a long time ago....or was it rumours about Bendtner?
Strangely enough I am missing Benayoun from last season. We need to get a similar player with PL experience and can prove to be a reliable squad option in terms of crisis.
We can now just hope that we get a few quality reinforcements and that this team gels enough to be a force to be reckoned with.
Strangely enough I am missing Benayoun from last season. We need to get a similar player with PL experience and can prove to be a reliable squad option in terms of crisis.
We can now just hope that we get a few quality reinforcements and that this team gels enough to be a force to be reckoned with.
kenkbc2
Well-Known Member
Two things stood out yesterday :-
1. Gibbs put in some pretty decent challenges. He could yet turn out to be that proper LB with good attacking qualities we've been craving for all along since the departure of Cole. He also looks to me to have more potential attacking wise than Clichy.
2. Cazorla - finally, we can lay the craving for a Cesc replica to rest!!
Two dropped points, but with a clean sheet. Not too dissapointing overall, all things taken into perspective. Remember the days when we used to get sucker punched by teams who parked the bus? Not happening this season with the Kos-TV partnership at the back, and hopefully a disciplined DM or a well organized midfield trio.
On to Stoke..
1. Gibbs put in some pretty decent challenges. He could yet turn out to be that proper LB with good attacking qualities we've been craving for all along since the departure of Cole. He also looks to me to have more potential attacking wise than Clichy.
2. Cazorla - finally, we can lay the craving for a Cesc replica to rest!!
Two dropped points, but with a clean sheet. Not too dissapointing overall, all things taken into perspective. Remember the days when we used to get sucker punched by teams who parked the bus? Not happening this season with the Kos-TV partnership at the back, and hopefully a disciplined DM or a well organized midfield trio.
On to Stoke..
The Escaped Ape
Well-Known Member
Ramsey doesn't appear to have changed much over the summer. I hope he gets a bit less playing time, spread over lower importance games, to build back a bit of fluency and confidence in his game. Should be possible now I'd hope. If he's still misfiring by the end of the season, maybe he belongs elsewhere...
@Escaped
I agree was just thinking the same. I hope he steps up. You could tell he really wants to get clicking again. He's always been a confidence player. It'd be nice to see him become a scoring impact sub to kill off games, and help with offensive output. The lad definitely has goals in him.
I agree was just thinking the same. I hope he steps up. You could tell he really wants to get clicking again. He's always been a confidence player. It'd be nice to see him become a scoring impact sub to kill off games, and help with offensive output. The lad definitely has goals in him.
ArsenalDNA
Well-Known Member
dreamLord said:
Idk where you expected our wingers to run but there was absolutely no room for them to run into. I thought Gervinho was our second most dangerous player despite his **** final ball tbh.
On the game itself.
It was always going to take a while for our players to gel. Considering that was the second game Cazorla, Podolski and Giroud had played with us i think there are good signs. Giroud's off the ball movement for the miss was decent and Podolski had good energy while he was on. I would have liked to have seen us with two up front when we went looking for the goal but i'm guessing Poldi was tired.
Defence started out shaky but didn't really get tested after like the 10th minute so still unsure. We didn't look like conceding after the McLean break but that's more down to the midfield then anything.
The tempo was ridiculously slow for pretty much the whole game. For now i'm happy to put that down to the heat/start of the season/settling in etc.
Sunderland will frustrate a lot of teams this year. Obviously we should have won but a point isn't the end of the world.
