Rings a bell, thought I was rock bottom, guess I am now.
I have stopped predicting rock bottoms for us now lol.
so many times I've thought we've reached it the past 2-3 years, only for them to prove me wrong
Rings a bell, thought I was rock bottom, guess I am now.
I think the manager people should be comparing Arteta to, at the moment, is Pochettino at Sp**s (ignoring that Arteta has actually won trophies already).
Potch went to Sp**s and immediately imposed a rigid structure on a shaky Sp**s team. It was clear how he wanted Sp**s to play (with structured buildup and pressing), but the early results weren't impressive. Sp**s looked too structured, were lacking creativity and seemed incapable of scoring goals. In his first season, they finished seventh with 64 points - a decline on the previous years' performance.
There were however some positive signs of Sp**s becoming a more competitive outfit, particularly in the big games. Sp**s were routinely thumped by their rivals before Potch arrived (sound familiar?). However, despite finishing with fewer points overall, Potch's Sp**s took more points off their big-6 rivals, and (while still losing more than they won) those losses were becoming much closer. Sp**s GD vs. the top 6 went from -24 the season before Potch arrived, to -11 in his first season.
A bigger improvement was noticeable in Potch's second season. They still weren't scoring much, but they were becoming a very difficult team to play against. Their GD improved by about 30 (mostly thanks to their defence) and - while slipping up too often against the weaker sides - they were now holding their own against the big 6, winning more than they lost and finishing with a +6 GD against their rivals. People were now starting to respect Sp**s as a very difficult team to play against: no longer a "soft touch". However, the classic refrain was that Sp**s would never score enough under Potch to compete at the top level.
Then, in his third season - and apparently out of nowhere - Potch's attack exploded. Sp**s finished with 86 points and were the top scorers in the league. Their defence also continued its year-on-year improvement. This wasn't due to any new signings (Sp**s that summer bought Victor Janssen and Moussa Sissoko); rather, the structure that Potch had been working on for the previous two seasons finally 'clicked'.
Now I'm not saying that Arteta is necessarily on the same trajectory here. However, I do think it's worth highlighting that there are a lot of similarities. Arteta also wants his team to play in a very structured manner, and (while the attack looks dreadful) it's clear to me that we've improved massively as a defensive unit, and are much more competitive vs. our rivals. In fact, if we are on the same trajectory as Sp**s under Potch, it looks like we're progressing a lot quicker than they did (especially on that trophy front). Bottom line is that I think people should be patient with the attack. Arteta's is trying to instil a new structured way of playing, which will always benefit the defence more quickly than the offence (which thrives on fluidity). Over time, those structures and patterns of play will hopefully become second-nature.
Essay over.
Hope so man, but they had what he had done at Southampton to fall back on.I think the manager people should be comparing Arteta to, at the moment, is Pochettino at Sp**s (ignoring that Arteta has actually won trophies already).
Potch went to Sp**s and immediately imposed a rigid structure on a shaky Sp**s team. It was clear how he wanted Sp**s to play (with structured buildup and pressing), but the early results weren't impressive. Sp**s looked too structured, were lacking creativity and seemed incapable of scoring goals. In his first season, they finished seventh with 64 points - a decline on the previous years' performance.
There were however some positive signs of Sp**s becoming a more competitive outfit, particularly in the big games. Sp**s were routinely thumped by their rivals before Potch arrived (sound familiar?). However, despite finishing with fewer points overall, Potch's Sp**s took more points off their big-6 rivals, and (while still losing more than they won) those losses were becoming much closer. Sp**s GD vs. the top 6 went from -24 the season before Potch arrived, to -11 in his first season.
A bigger improvement was noticeable in Potch's second season. They still weren't scoring much, but they were becoming a very difficult team to play against. Their GD improved by about 30 (mostly thanks to their defence) and - while slipping up too often against the weaker sides - they were now holding their own against the big 6, winning more than they lost and finishing with a +6 GD against their rivals. People were now starting to respect Sp**s as a very difficult team to play against: no longer a "soft touch". However, the classic refrain was that Sp**s would never score enough under Potch to compete at the top level.
Then, in his third season - and apparently out of nowhere - Potch's attack exploded. Sp**s finished with 86 points and were the top scorers in the league. Their defence also continued its year-on-year improvement. This wasn't due to any new signings (Sp**s that summer bought Victor Janssen and Moussa Sissoko); rather, the structure that Potch had been working on for the previous two seasons finally 'clicked'.
Now I'm not saying that Arteta is necessarily on the same trajectory here. However, I do think it's worth highlighting that there are a lot of similarities. Arteta also wants his team to play in a very structured manner, and (while the attack looks dreadful) it's clear to me that we've improved massively as a defensive unit, and are much more competitive vs. our rivals. In fact, if we are on the same trajectory as Sp**s under Potch, it looks like we're progressing a lot quicker than they did (especially on that trophy front). Bottom line is that I think people should be patient with the attack. Arteta's is trying to instil a new structured way of playing, which will always benefit the defence more quickly than the offence (which thrives on fluidity). Over time, those structures and patterns of play will hopefully become second-nature.
Essay over.
They were cutting us up at will. The defence hasn’t improved at all, we’ve just put 10 men behind the ball and totally neglected the attack.People here kid themselves that we have a good defence because ****ing Leeds got unlucky with double figures attempts
They were cutting us up at will. The defence hasn’t improved at all, we’ve just put 10 men behind the ball and totally neglected the attack.
wehave a decent defence, but we been riding our luck. I cant see us having top 5 defences in the league by the end of it. Will probably concede 47-50 goalsPeople here kid themselves that we have a good defence because ****ing Leeds got unlucky with double figures attempts
Against Leicester we attacked from the start.They were cutting us up at will. The defence hasn’t improved at all, we’ve just put 10 men behind the ball and totally neglected the attack.
That is not the dominant view today. Following Guardiola's success at Barcelona (Pep is about as structured as its possible to be), the majority of top coaches have adopted at least some elements of his 'positional-play' philosophy (which he developed from guys like Van Gaal, Cruyff and Michels). And Arteta is a Pep disciple.
E.g. both CL finalists from last season (Tuchel and Flick) had highly structured attacks, as have all the recent PL winners (Pep, Klopp and Conte). Like it or not, that's how modern teams play.
Yeah, that’s great.Against Leicester we attacked from the start.
There was most definitely not 10 men behind the ball.
Like Özil and Willian?An attacking midfielder and a creative winger would instantly take us up three levels and we'll look much better going forward.
They are all crap didn’t you know.It is funny that we are playing with such rigidity as I do believe we have the tools here to succeed.
We have quick wingers: Nelson, Saka, Pepe.
Good striker: Auba , Laca
Creative midfielder: Özil, Willian
Dynamic Midfielder: Ceballos, Partey, ESR
Defensive Midfielder: Elneny , Partey
Box to box: Willock
So I don’t see why we can’t get a fluid attack going if we utilize our personnel effectively and play to their strengths.
Like Özil and Willian?
Seems to me our players are being drilled to make keeping possession a priority over breaking quickly. Works against us in attack because our build-up play is predictable, often too slow and taking too many touches to get the ball upfield. Also works against us when we play the ball at the back under pressure with little reward and huge potential downsides. We should be taking risks in the opponent's half, not our own.It is funny that we are playing with such rigidity as I do believe we have the tools here to succeed.
We have quick wingers: Nelson, Saka, Pepe.
Good striker: Auba , Laca
Creative midfielder: Özil, Willian
Dynamic Midfielder: Ceballos, Partey, ESR
Defensive Midfielder: Elneny , Partey
Box to box: Willock
So I don’t see why we can’t get a fluid attack going if we utilize our personnel effectively and play to their strengths.
All I’ve been trying to say this whole time. Crap on the roster all you like but there’s literally no excuse for some of the stuff we’ve seen.You can debate the quality of the players in the context of top 4 but at the moment Arteta isn't getting top half performances out of them
Like Özil and Willian?