The January Transfer Window

[irishgunnerz]

Ah but a good attack is a good defence. Disagree with both Anzac and Biggus. We have defended well lately or certainly far better than previously - but as you pointed out in another thread Biggus we have 5 draws in the past ten games.

At our attacking best, teams just didnt attack as much as they were afraid of being hit hard on the break. Look at United...how many teams have a genuine go at them? Almost none because they fear United's attacking prowess.

Great defence and average attacking play will win you nothing. Certainly not a league. However an average defence and a free scoring attack is far more effective as the very fact youre attack is well known leads to a reluctance for opposition manager to encourage teams forward.

I remember a quote quote after a match , cant remember the game or the opposition but Arsenal hammered a team by 3 or 4 .. and asked about one of the goals , the manager said 'well it come from a mistake on our part'...when interview asked why he just said something like 'we pushed forward and won a corner!'

 

[hackajack]

Since the PL started it has largely been won by attacking teams.

 

[Zico]

Anzac, possession maps will show you that in recent years, Wenger's teams have enjoyed the lion's share of possession, and have managed to operate around the opposition team's penalty area for long periods of time. Yet, we have continued to leak goals and not win a single thing.

Beyond needing a better DCM, we really need SIGNIFICANTLY improved defensive coaching. I wish Wenger would just admit he is clueless about defense and bring in a specialist defense coach.

 

[otfgoon]

Otfgoon, take another look at the table. United are disappearing over the horizon but have scored only TWO goals more than us. There is nothing more valuable than the 1-0 victory.

Take another look at WHEN we scored those goals and take a look at where we were in the table at the time.

And this sudden myth that United have turned into a defensive team absolutely baffles me, having a good defensive record and a solid defence =/= being a defence first team. Anyone who has watched United in recent weeks will tell you they're anything but defensive.

Their problems have been in the final third, they have no real goalscorer, but they're attacking and dominating games as much as ever.

 

[Burnwinter]

United also have excellent central defenders, and Ferguson has a policy of spending on defenders which we have never tried to match. Ferguson has broken the international transfer record for a CB at least twice ... and there's no arguing that Vidic has been immense for them this season as well.

Van der Sar's 1200+ minutes of clean sheets can hardly be entirely down to the potency of their attack.

 

[Illusion]

His clean sheet record is down to the uselessness of their opponents coupled with a good defence, although it's important to remember that they haven't had their first choice line up at the back for quite a few of those games on the way to breaking the clean sheet record.

 

[Zico]

Otfgoon, whoever called United a defensive team? Are you reading posts or just responding in a fit of fury? There success is not based on playing defensive football like Rafa or Fabio. Rather it comes largely from excellent coordination amongst defenders and midfielders, and having the right mix of size and speed to stop the opposition. It helps to have good defenders as well, and it would be hard to argue that when fully fit, they have 2 of the top 3 central defenders in the league, and the best left back.

A lot of their defensive success is also based on midfield's ability to win and hold the ball. We had a bit of this last year, but gave it away by sending Flamini and Hleb packing. The key thing to remember is that your four defenders cannot be seen in isolation. A large part of good defense is your ability to win the ball back in midfield, the help-defense offered by midfield, and your ability to hold possession and frustrate the opposition.

 

[otfgoon]

Otfgoon, whoever called United a defensive team? Are you reading posts or just responding in a fit of fury? There success is not based on playing defensive football like Rafa or Fabio. Rather it comes largely from excellent coordination amongst defenders and midfielders, and having the right mix of size and speed to stop the opposition. It helps to have good defenders as well, and it would be hard to argue that when fully fit, they have 2 of the top 3 central defenders in the league, and the best left back.

A lot of their defensive success is also based on midfield's ability to win and hold the ball. We had a bit of this last year, but gave it away by sending Flamini and Hleb packing. The key thing to remember is that your four defenders cannot be seen in isolation. A large part of good defense is your ability to win the ball back in midfield, the help-defense offered by midfield, and your ability to hold possession and frustrate the opposition.

I wont argue with any of that as most of it is spot on, and I've not said our defence is perfect or that it doesnt need to improve. I dont think anyone here has refuted our need for a suitible defensive partner for Cesc either.

There are a few who have said we need to give up our attacking philosophy and have pointed to United as an example of why, thats what I've been arguing against. The tone of your posts suggested you were one of those but if not then fair enough.

 

[outlaw_member]

Man Utd aren't a defensive team, per se. However, they are capable of playing a certain way, due to the quality of their attackers. They only attack with 4 players, whilst defending with 6. If you leave 6 players back, than it is very unlikely your going to concede, because it's a defensively cautious approach. However, it's the potency of their attackers, that allows them to leave so many players behind.

Arsenal can't leave that many behind the ball, because Nasri, Walcott, RVP and Ade alone would not be capable of penetrating the opposition. It takes special players to do the damage on their own, similar to how Henry, Bergkamp, Pires and Ljungberg did in the past. The majority of big clubs cannot afford to leave so many players back, because their attackers aren't potent enough to carry the attacking burden on their own. Man Utd have 3 special attackers in Ronaldo, Rooney, Berbatov/Tevez, who can all do damage without the need for extra support. Other than Barcelona, every other attack needs more support, therefore they are less solid defensively. It's the threat of United's attackers, that enables them to defend with more players, culminating in many clean sheets.

You can't stay solid if you only have 3 players defending, like we do. Whereas Man Utd have 6 back, therefore making it much easier to stay compact. That also explains why O'Shea, Rafael, Evans and Fabio don't struggle whenever they play, because they are playing within a defensive setup. Look at Liverpool, they have shown why you can't defend in such a way, if you don't have the attacking players to carry the extra burden. They have a brilliant defence, but without an even better attack, it hasn't proved to be successful for them. Man Utd possess this, which is why they can get away with playing such a system.

 

[Biggus]

Shouldn´t we lock this now? I´m glad January is gone and I´m extremely happy the next transfer window is in 5 months. It was a difficult month.

Agreed Tomas. Fellas we can carry on these discussions elsewhere.
For anyone who's just emerged from a coma, the January transfer window is closed- we got Arshavin.