Arsenal v. Sunderland [League - 21 Feb 2009 15:00]

[Kraig]

You know something, forget it, I cant be bothered. Apologies Anthony. I'm very wound up right now.

Tell me about it. I can't believe we haven't scored in three whole games!

I cant believe we haven't won in 4 premier league games! It honestly kills me to see us in our current state. I physically hurt! :evil:

 

[M+D]

Well I thought Denilson, Arshavin and Almunia are the only three players who should get any credit today.

Its a real shame so many of you can't decide to judge Arsenal players based on their actual performance, without your bitterness at the fact his name isn't Xabi Alonso or Gokhan Inler clouding judgement so obviously.

 

[progman07]

Well I thought Denilson, Arshavin and Almunia are the only three players who should get any credit today.

Its a real shame so many of you can't decide to judge Arsenal players based on their actual performance, without your bitterness at the fact his name isn't Xabi Alonso or Gokhan Inler clouding judgement so obviously.

Denilson why exactly? He did nothing to help us win this game.

 

[Kraig]

Well I thought Denilson, Arshavin and Almunia are the only three players who should get any credit today.

Its a real shame so many of you can't decide to judge Arsenal players based on their actual performance, without your bitterness at the fact his name isn't Xabi Alonso or Gokhan Inler clouding judgement so obviously.

In all honesty, i havent watched todays game yet. But the record has been played many many times. Denilson has been consistently poor all season long, and whilst im not saying he didnt have a bad game today (although alot of people on here seem to think so and from what i heard on the radio that was also the premise i was given) it has happened all too many times with him and Song in the middle. It just doesnt work and needs rectifying.

 

[sabret00the]

The reactions as per those seen in this thread are understandable. More than understandable in fact, but perhaps a little on the side of thoughtless.

This was always gonna be a hard game to get the players motivated for. And with Chelsea beating Villa, even more so. We were without Dudu who was undoubtedly a huge lift for the entire squad and normally, while Arshavin's debut should've been that lift, it was overshadowed by Dudu's return and then return to injury.

I felt as the game opened, we created some beautiful chances, however as the game went on, we showed outselves to be lacking just a bit.

I'm not gonna put blame on anyone bar Wenger today. He knows that teams play with ten men behind the ball and has yet to find the solution. His initial plan to deal with this (more goals from midfield) has proven to be beyond naive. And instead of making us a more potent attacking force. We've been shown to be wanting in terms of contribution from our strikers when they're needed the most. There is no excuse for the lack of movement and the lack of shots on target from our strikers.

I understand completely how we got here. But it's wrong. We're in a mire right now because our team is so out of wack. Defenders need to defender first and foremost. Wingers need to create first and foremost. Midfielders need to control the game first and foremost and strikers need to score first and foremost. However in our current squad. Our defenders spend half their time attacking. Midfielders are helping out the defence or just faciliating the ball moving. Wingers are trying to score. And strikers are trying to create. We're ****ed.

 

[qs]

The more I think about it the more I think Vela should have started today. Yeah he should have scored in him time in the game but we seriously lack a player with his movement up front.

 

[progman07]

The more I think about it the more I think Vela should have started today. Yeah he should have scored in him time in the game but we seriously lack a player with his movement up front.

True, and hopefully his misses don't give Wenger the excuse to exclude him again and again. He shows some positivity and directness, which we so often lack.

 

[Kraig]

The more I think about it the more I think Vela should have started today. Yeah he should have scored in him time in the game but we seriously lack a player with his movement up front.

True, and hopefully his misses don't give Wenger the excuse to exclude him again and again. He shows some positivity and directness, which we so often lack.

despite his misses, he offered more in a short space of time than alot of our other midfielders have offered. He will score those chances normally so we should keep on giving him the chances to do so.

 

[Muharraqawi]

I personally don't blame Song and Denilson.

They are young players and they are physically, mentally, and technically not ready yet to start every game in the EPL, players like them in the past were limited to starting in the Carling Cup plus some plus some other games.

The position their playing in needs a lot of diffrent skills and attributes that they can only get when they are older and more experienced.

They are both trying to give 100 percent every game but they are simply not ready and not good enough yet to start for us and I personally blame Wenger for that for not bringing the proper replacements after the departures of Flamini and Gilberto.

Personally I think that Stephen Appiah would be a good buy if we bring him on even if we only keep him until the end of the season because he has attributes we lack at the moment like experience and strength.

 

[otfgoon]

We desperately needed to score in the first 20 mins, as the game wore on the confidance drained away, we got more desperate, Arshavin become more tired and Sunderland defended deeper.

No excuses though, if we cant win these games then we dont deserve 4th.

 

[qs]

True, if we don't score in the first 20 minutes you know you'll have to wait until the last for anything.

 

[Illusion]

Most of you are overlooking the biggest reason for our lack of goals. Our opponents have sussed us out, they know what to do to stop us and we have no way of countering that.

The Setanta US co-commentator summed it up perfectly for me when he said most of our opponents have learnt not to attempt to win the ball from us until around the penalty area. The rest of the time they just bide their time and let us play around them, always closing us down and waiting for the inevitable moment when a pass goes astray or we try too hard and make a mistake.

We've been found out tactically and we have no answers for it, that is the truly horrifying problem.

Everyone knows how to play against us now and the more these tactics continue to nullify our offensive capabilities completely the more our opponents will continue to use them.

Lay off the players for a bit and focus on the ineptitude of our tactics as that's the biggest problem I can see. Even our ideal first team would have struggled today because we always play the same way and it's so easy to stop.

 

[otfgoon]

snip

Tactics have very little to do with it. All this talk about "teams have figured it out" is nonsense, they used to do the exact same for the old sides and they'd get torn apart. It was considered suicidle to sit back against the old invincibles side.

The main difference is a lack of movement or clever movement. Honestly, watch the game again and see what happens when we get close to the area, time and time again I screamed when I saw everyone bar Robin and Vela when he came on were simply standing still scrartching their arse.

 

[kel varnsen]

Its all well and good criticising players but when you haven't got a clue where a players strengths and weaknesses are why should I bother debating with you. You consistently post nonsense far beyond delusional and thats why I so rarely reply to anything you post.

Your match day ratings are a laughing stock at this stage.

I'm not bothered replying to you any more. My mistake was giving you time on this occasion.

yes, yes. whatever. fact is, denilson is slow and hesitant on the ball. if you think releasing the ball quickly is one of denilson's strengths, it's no wonder you think he's a good player. it would be like me saying eboue is a marvelous dribler and that is why he's a brilliant winge. i mean, as long as we're just pulling stuff out of thin air...

 

[patrick42uk]

For me, Sunderland didnt have to work for that result. Yeah the played 11 behind the ball but we played into their hands by playing slow, unimaginative football. We never tested them.

 

[algunner]

We had chaces more than enough to score 3 goals. This is bullshit when some of you say the midfeld was not good or this player was not poor. We had enough chances to win the game comfortably but we missed them from Vela 2, Bentdner 2, Kolo 1, Arshavin 2, RVP 2 and Gallas 1 ...I mean can somebody tell me when you have all these chances created and you can not score ONE GOAL. This is just a joke !!!! The team is good to win many games but they are F***ING wasteful and lazy. Someone says if the team is not ambitious I am not signing a new contract. PUT THE F***ing BALL in the net when you get a chance and win games that makes the team ambitious.

 

[AFCG7]

Thats right patrick42uk - it wasnt as if it was backs to the wall defending amidst constant pressure. They did it quite easily which says it all really. Its no point having Arshavin RVP and Nasri if our two CM's take alunch break everytime they receive the ball, during which time Sunderland's players strolled back into position.

 

[famous no 10]

For me, Sunderland didnt have to work for that result. Yeah the played 11 behind the ball but we played into their hands by playing slow, unimaginative football. We never tested them.

...and you think we could have learned how to break sides like that down by now, as nearly every team that comes to us plays the same way.

You can't blame them, they're not as gifted as us but know they can work just as hard...trouble is, there isn't enough movement from the cm's or stikers to draw them out, neither is the final ball from cm precise enough to split the defence...we've lost the very strengths we had, movement, speed and precision.

Of course we have Cesc waiting to come back which will make a huge difference, but his role will still be limited because of the average players pairing him...i,e, Song and Denilson. I'm afraid as most Gooners know, the writing was on the wall when we didn't replace the departing Flamini/Gilberto in the summer...it's so frigging obvious but Wenger and his lateral thinking approach to our squad has forced sqare pegs into round holes.

Quite honestly, it doesn't make a huge difference that we have good strikers, and Theo, Arshavin, whoever...if the centre of the park is negative then we could still have Henry up front and not have much joy still...it's poosible that the centre could be filled by Cesc and another creative player, and on good days we'll score a few, but our defence will be ripped to shreds.

No balance.

 

[JazzG]

Been thinking about this since the final whistle, a real big blow to our CL places for next season. This one really hurts.

The more I think about it the more I think Vela should have started today. Yeah he should have scored in him time in the game but we seriously lack a player with his movement up front.

Would of started him and put Arshavin on in his place after 60 minutes.

 

[Illusion]

snip

Tactics have very little to do with it. All this talk about "teams have figured it out" is nonsense, they used to do the exact same for the old sides and they'd get torn apart. It was considered suicidle to sit back against the old invincibles side.

The main difference is a lack of movement or clever movement. Honestly, watch the game again and see what happens when we get close to the area, time and time again I screamed when I saw everyone bar Robin and Vela when he came on were simply standing still scrartching their arse.

Watch some of the old games, most of the teams would be defensive yes, but there are two main differences. Firstly they would be actively trying to win the ball of us in their half, something they do not do anymore and secondly when we lost possession we had a high quality ball winning midfield capable of harassing the opposition into mistakes or tackling them to win the ball back. These two things combined gave us a whole lot more space for our players to move into, to break into and to create chances with.

I don't want to accept my beloved team is being outwitted every week by lesser teams but that's how it is right now.

To add further weight to my argument, watch the Cardiff game. They were actively trying to win the ball off us and play a little faster than Sunderland/West Ham. They gave us space and didn't put most of their men behind the ball waiting for us to beat them and it cost them dearly.

It's no wonder they play the way they do when you see what we do when they don't.