PL: Arsenal vs West Ham United | 07/04/07

[M+D]

Just saw highlights again.......AND WTF WAS GALLAS DOING FOR THE GOAL!

I'm sorry but it is inexcusable I'm afraid. He was in the oppositions penalty box ffs. Probably the only main threat from West Ham the whole game and he left Toure by himself to deal with it. Toure perhaps could've done better, but still...
And for the only other threat from West Ham (Boa Morte's chance), everyone stepped up for offside and Kolo stayed put, playing him on. Now that is a schoolboy error and while the missed chances obviously cost us more than anything else, the lack of communication and togetherness and concentration in the back four has been diabolical the last few games.

I just hope with games (that was only fourth time they've played together) they will improve and become a unit....

 

[Mr Wolf]

[DC GHunner wrote: there is a reason why we are not scoring much:
1-We don't shoot
2-we don't look dangerous from Corners and set pieces].

You're perfectly right. We don't shoot because we want to enter the goal with the ball, we tend to overelaborate our passing football.
And we are not dangerous from corners because we don't play anymore on the header. The header (particularly from the central defenders) belongs to the traditional English way of playing football, a tradition that we have forgotten (maybe it's not enough refined?). It's a great mistake, the header is a very important weapon that can help you to solve certain games when the forwards don't find spaces....

 

[rednwhitearmy]

[DC GHunner wrote: there is a reason why we are not scoring much:
1-We don't shoot
2-we don't look dangerous from Corners and set pieces].

You're perfectly right. We don't shoot because we want to enter the goal with the ball, we tend to overelaborate our passing football.
And we are not dangerous from corners because we don't play anymore on the header. The header (particularly from the central defenders) belongs to the traditional English way of playing football, a tradition that we have forgotten (maybe it's not enough refined?). It's a great mistake, the header is a very important weapon that can help you to solve certain games when the forwards don't find spaces....

I thought we looked dangerous from a cross, but yes Set Pieces are a weakness both in defence and attack. but Eboue, Hleb, and Clichy's crosses were dangerous. I did like that. I kept thinking of the Manchester United goal (Thierry Henry). Will remain with me forever. and then that lil dance. Gotta love it!

 

[Glovegun]

It seems to me like Wenger looks down his nose at finishing as a skill, one not really worth teaching to his players and definately not important enough to consider actually buying a goalscorer.

What is incrediby annoying is that whatever tactics you come up with, whatever formation, a goal is still a goal, and one scrambled in from a yard out is worth exactly the same as a beauty = 1 GOAL. How many times this season have we seen Chelsea bailed out because Lumpard caught a lucky deflection or someone actually attacked the ball in the air late on? I absolutely love our football, but if it doesnt get you anywhere theres no point to it. Our entire philosophy is based on the theory of manufacturing the easiest chances possible (eg sliding someone through for a one on on rather than shooting from distance) but if that person misses the chance, you've failed. If you create 10 chances and miss them all, you lose to a side that creates 1 and takes it. This is NOT a fluke - its happened all season.

If I were Wenger the first thing I would do this season is buy a STRIKER. Not a "prefer to play in the hole and sometimes drift out wide" type player but someone who scores GOALS. There are hundreds of players in this league who, though substandard in other respects, could notch 20-30 goals a season in this Arsenal team - Johnson, Bent, Defoe, Fowler, King, Owen. I also wouldnt mind betting that Stokes could have done that job too, but oh well - "Wenger knows best".

 

[rednwhitearmy]

but oh well - "Wenger knows best".

well he obviously does...he is the manager.

 

[Tony Montana]

Cheer up Jgunner, try to think of some funny jokes. Heres one....

I thought Hleb was a huge threat upfront.

Am I missing the joke?
Did you guys watch the same game as me?
I have never ever seen a forum that HATES Hleb so much. You tend to leave Ljungberg alone etc. but why Hleb.
He puts his heart and soul into each minute, and all he gets is total bullsh*t from the fans. Its totally disrespectful, and I as a supporter am appauled by the actions and comments put forward in this forum.
LIGHTEN UP! The sport is a TEAM game, and to those criticising Hleb's resistance to shoot, have a look at Adebayor and Eboue, and see how they were in the box and didnt shoot.

It's ovious you're biased towards Hleb though. You have his picture as an avatar with 'ze Hleb crew' on it. You're like Lukazan. Hleb was in no way more of an attacking than Adebayor mate. It's a team game and the whole team were crap at finishing but Hleb had a poor game in my opinion although he was not the only one. Ljungberg has faced tons of criticism on this website but we're all agreed that he should go while Hleb has divided opinion somewhat. There are people who HATE Senderos, Henry, Rosicky, Eboue and Ljungberg, if you could call it hate.

 

[kel varnsen]

Just saw highlights again.......AND WTF WAS GALLAS DOING FOR THE GOAL!

I'm sorry but it is inexcusable I'm afraid. He was in the oppositions penalty box ffs. Probably the only main threat from West Ham the whole game and he left Toure by himself to deal with it. Toure perhaps could've done better, but still...
And for the only other threat from West Ham (Boa Morte's chance), everyone stepped up for offside and Kolo stayed put, playing him on. Now that is a schoolboy error and while the missed chances obviously cost us more than anything else, the lack of communication and togetherness and concentration in the back four has been diabolical the last few games.

I just hope with games (that was only fourth time they've played together) they will improve and become a unit....

i don't see anything wrong with that. gallas pushed up and joined the previous attack. toure does it all the time and gallas is there to 'bail' him out.

if there's anyone to blame for the goal, it's the linesman and lehmann. zamora was offside and lehmann was caught in no man's land.

 

[otfgoon]

Just saw highlights again.......AND WTF WAS GALLAS DOING FOR THE GOAL!

I'm sorry but it is inexcusable I'm afraid. He was in the oppositions penalty box ffs. Probably the only main threat from West Ham the whole game and he left Toure by himself to deal with it. Toure perhaps could've done better, but still...
And for the only other threat from West Ham (Boa Morte's chance), everyone stepped up for offside and Kolo stayed put, playing him on. Now that is a schoolboy error and while the missed chances obviously cost us more than anything else, the lack of communication and togetherness and concentration in the back four has been diabolical the last few games.

I just hope with games (that was only fourth time they've played together) they will improve and become a unit....

i don't see anything wrong with that. gallas pushed up and joined the previous attack. toure does it all the time and gallas is there to 'bail' him out.

if there's anyone to blame for the goal, it's the linesman and lehmann. zamora was offside and lehmann was caught in no man's land.

I'd also look at Kolo who was there but seemed to be determined to give himself a challenge by letting Zamora have a headstart.

 

[henry79]

There is a real goal scoring problem in this team, I'm just about to make a post in another thread about it as well but it is something that seriously needs to be addressed. IMO we need at minimum another proper goal scoring midfielder before we think about becoming title contenders.

I thought Rosicky was supposed to be that scoring midfielder.
How about Cesc, his shots lack power and that is a fact of life. No one please tell me he is only 19, if you are a starter for Arsenal, better play and shoot like ones do, otherwise you are prematurely inserted into the gameplay.

I can't believe a blind shooter like Lampard scores his goals through power and deflections, look @ C**t Ronaldo, his shot is strong, he almost beheaded Jen @ OT this season. Rooney has strong shot as well.

And no one tells me go become Manure Fan, I hate them with passion.

Every time I catch a long shot goal , I think "Arsenal will not do that" , Look No further than the CL goals few days ago.

Bergie used to shoot, Paddy used to shoot, I even remember Parlour scoring from Long range

there is a reason why we are not scoring much:
1-We don't shoot
2-we don't look dangerous from Corners and set pieces.

With goal scoring you either have the art or not. Look at Romario, the most laziest c**t you will ever find but that guy would score even if you blind folded him. Then there are players like Hleb and Cesc who dont look like scoring even if you blindfold the goalkeeper!

I cant believe you thought rosicky would solve our scoring problem, have you checked his stats he is not a free goal scoring midfielder, when wenger said he will replace pires I had to laugh you cant compare pires to rosicky pires was a goal scoring midlfieder before joining us.

we have 3 players in midfield who will not score a goal but they rather assist in one. hleb fabregas and rosicky and there is where our problem lies. I would have flamini in there just for us getting a goal I know I am desperate !!!!! but what can we do.

 

[DC Gunner]

I cant believe you thought rosicky would solve our scoring problem, have you checked his stats he is not a free goal scoring midfielder, when wenger said he will replace pires I had to laugh you cant compare pires to rosicky pires was a goal scoring midlfieder before joining us.

Well, I had to believe Wenger. What other options did I have since I rarely watched the Bundesliga.

In other words , I had to take Arsène's word for it that Rosicky was to be the one, and that is the point I am making.

we have 3 players in midfield who will not score a goal but they rather assist in one. hleb fabregas and rosicky and there is where our problem lies. I would have flamini in there just for us getting a goal I know I am desperate !!!!! but what can we do.

You know, the flamini thought crossed my mind yesterday, somehow that guy gets few goals when no one expects him to do so, maybe because no one cares about his existence, or just maybe he is desperate for a spot in the team and is actually trying hard to win himself a spot.

 

[patrick42uk]

i'm not really sure who to blame for the goal. what we had to do there was play zamora offiside. he was offside but what changed the linesman's mind probably was toure running back to get in line with the defence/cover the hole central.

 

[Viper]

I think it's Wenger. He tells the players to past first, shoot later.

Hleb is the biggest culprit. He'll never ever score a vital goal for us, and doesn't ever look like a match winner.

I'm glad Rosicky is shooting and is getting close, but his miss was simply inexcusable. He should've buried that in. God knows when Fabregas will start scoring. He has had enough chances to score at least 10 Premiership goals. You could also say the same about Rosicky.

Adebayor is missing a sitter after a sitter after a sitter after a sitter. His finishing is very poor.

 

[athreya74]

Two of the most depressing things about yesterday's game was that
a) I didn't have any expectation of our players finishing off all the build-up. And it was confirmed in the first five mins itself. Perhaps, it's got so bad now that some of the players - Cesc, Rosicky - also don't have any hopes of scoring.

b) When Zamorra got ahead of Toure, I instinctively knew Lehamnn will get it wrong. What pissed me off was that he didn't try to backpedal and do something about it but instead turned like a tank to see the ball going in.

I was also surprised that Diaby came on so late in the game. And where is Flamini? It is pretty well agreed he is going in the summer so why not put him in the shop window and take advantage of his never say die spirit? Particularly when we are playing 4-5-1?

I am so depressed now that I think that not finishing in top 4 may be a blessing in disguise. We will know then how many of the players themselves believe in the "great potential" story? A recurring thought I have had over the last few weeks is what happens to Arsène's masterplan if one of the vital components like Cesc or RvP decide to cut loose?

 

[the dawn raids]

Nothing wrong with the performance today, we battered them senseless but like it has been pointed out many times this season we don't have a killer instinct infront of goal and a lack of genuine goalscorers as well makes things worse.

well obviously something is pretty wrong with your performance when the most vital part of a good performance is the very thing you struggle with the most. the one part of the game where you cant afford to be average is where this team is downright abysmal.

asa made a good point about injuries, yes theyre unfortunate, but its not as if van persie or henry being injured is something new. frankly it was a cruel misjudgement by wenger to leave us with our only alternatives being 1. a forward who has talent, but hadnt proved he can score on a regular basis (and still hasnt as far as im concerned), 2. a forward who has been on numerous loans and still hasnt found a permanent suitor (youd figure that would tell you all you need to know about him) and 3. another forward who hadnt played a game in the premiership, and whose severely struggling with the physicality and pace of the league.

the midfield is just as abysmal; i wouldnt be suprised if we have the lowest output of goals from midfield in the permiership (13 as fas as i can remember; 8 for gilberto, hleb 2 flamini 2 rosicky 1; surely there has to be more than that isnt there?) i mean christ, paul ****ing robinson has more league goals than fabregas, whose played more minutes than anyone on our team bar lehmann. and no one give me this **** about him being unlucky; bad luck pops up in 2 or 3 games, not 31. the question has been asked repeatedly and still hasnt been answered adequately: what the hells the point of having playmakers when you have no one to finish those plays off?

i just find it absurd that the most important part of the game seems to be the part weve neglected the most and emphasised the least in recent years.

 

[ZanYGooneR]

Why do people hate Ali,
for one he creates chances for himself and other all the time, his pace is something that troubles defenders and his wastefullness isnt as bad as any body else.

seriously i think he bounced some FA chairmans daughter or something because i remember all those dissallowed penalties he was earning from us (2 at blackburn, and one at everton, which could have one us the game)

He's the worst for missing chances.

Its him nd Baps that need to go

I totally agree with you mate, how anyone can defend Aliadiere is beyond me. FACT the guy has only ever scored 1 premiership goal EVER and that was in 2002 against West Brom!!!! That is an absolute joke. To say the guy is class as one fan on here pointed out is even more of a joke.

How on earth can anyone say Aliadiere is class I mean based on what?? Please tell me as I'm at a loss to see what is so special about this useless, arrogant, waste of space player some people go on about. He's leaving in the summer for sure and I for 1 can't wait to see the back of him. I mean Baptista's been so poor and even he's got 1 goal in the league this year, I mean what does that tell you?? Aliadiere's unlucky...... stop kidding yourselves.

As for the game, 1-1 for me and if were not careful we might even be staring our first home defeat in the face

Unfortunatly I was right about us not being careful and those who thought we were going to win 3-1, you obviously haven't been watching Arsenal in the past month as you would have realised that we dont have the players out there who will score 3 goals in a game.

Our best chance of winning at the moment is very slim based in recent matches but if we we are to win it's going to be a 1-0 to the Arsenal. Even this seems very unlikely based the performance of our defence in recent matches.

The game itself.....well what can you say that hasn't already been said time and time again this season. There's no way we deserved to lose that match yesterday no way but once again we did, and why did we?? Simply because of our inability to put the ball in between the posts, that's it. If we carry on I'm sorry to say this but I can't see us finishing 4th which would be inexcusable.

 

[brady]

The other reason we are losing many of these games is that we concede silly and soft goals against teams due to lapses in concentration or simply naive defending. I am beginning to think that there is no emphasis on defensive coaching - the comment before one game about practising defending set pieces was instructive.

Once we fall behind, the confidence goes, and the other team's confidence goes up correspondingly. And what does not help us is that we continue to play the same way, threading ball after ball into the middle while no one really makes the runs, with Freddie being the exception. The rest are always lurking outside the box, as someone here pointed out. Hell even Ade shows up on the wing too much and when he's our only out and out striker and hangs out on the wing we are in big trouble.

We have too many playmakers. I agree with the point made about Flamini. He wants to make things happen and has scored more goals than the whole lot currently? Well definitely more than Cesc and Rosicky.

Nothing per se against threading balls in if we vary the final approach. Take shots for instance. We are shooting more but almost always under pressure because it comes at the end of a dribble when players are no longer thinking right.

I would not be surprised if most of our shots come when we are already behind or in the second half. We still start off trying to walk the ball in. Too many wrong choices. Sometimes we can and should shoot early on when another pass is probably too much and unnecessary. And sometimes an extra pass is better in the later stages of the game when the other team is stretched and tired out and diving into challenges in desperation. Is this a sign of immaturity? Maybe.

There is no way this lot became a bad team overnight. But they have to learn and learn fast. If the season ended tomorrow I would take it. Far too many games left and the chasing pack is getting encouraged.

 

[Biggus]

Nothing wrong with the performance today, we battered them senseless but like it has been pointed out many times this season we don't have a killer instinct infront of goal and a lack of genuine goalscorers as well makes things worse.

well obviously something is pretty wrong with your performance when the most vital part of a good performance is the very thing you struggle with the most. the one part of the game where you cant afford to be average is where this team is downright abysmal.

asa made a good point about injuries, yes theyre unfortunate, but its not as if van persie or henry being injured is something new. frankly it was a cruel misjudgement by wenger to leave us with our only alternatives being 1. a forward who has talent, but hadnt proved he can score on a regular basis (and still hasnt as far as im concerned), 2. a forward who has been on numerous loans and still hasnt found a permanent suitor (youd figure that would tell you all you need to know about him) and 3. another forward who hadnt played a game in the premiership, and whose severely struggling with the physicality and pace of the league.

the midfield is just as abysmal; i wouldnt be suprised if we have the lowest output of goals from midfield in the permiership (13 as fas as i can remember; 8 for gilberto, hleb 2 flamini 2 rosicky 1; surely there has to be more than that isnt there?) i mean christ, paul f****g robinson has more league goals than fabregas, whose played more minutes than anyone on our team bar lehmann. and no one give me this s**t about him being unlucky; bad luck pops up in 2 or 3 games, not 31. the question has been asked repeatedly and still hasnt been answered adequately: what the hells the point of having playmakers when you have no one to finish those plays off?

i just find it absurd that the most important part of the game seems to be the part weve neglected the most and emphasised the least in recent years.

TheDawn is right Jazz.....Its like saying: the operation was a success- but the patient died. All the buildup play is pointless if it fails to lead up to putting the ball in the net which is after all the aim of the game. I'm sure YBF could reel off countless statistics about how many 10 yard side passes Hleb completed, but football is not like cricket or baseball. The only stat I look at is in the top corner, thats all that counts.

Athyera- the most depressing this for me is that we could see this coming all season. FFS Its happened for half the home games.

 

[rednwhitearmy]

Nothing wrong with the performance today, we battered them senseless but like it has been pointed out many times this season we don't have a killer instinct infront of goal and a lack of genuine goalscorers as well makes things worse.

well obviously something is pretty wrong with your performance when the most vital part of a good performance is the very thing you struggle with the most. the one part of the game where you cant afford to be average is where this team is downright abysmal.

asa made a good point about injuries, yes theyre unfortunate, but its not as if van persie or henry being injured is something new. frankly it was a cruel misjudgement by wenger to leave us with our only alternatives being 1. a forward who has talent, but hadnt proved he can score on a regular basis (and still hasnt as far as im concerned), 2. a forward who has been on numerous loans and still hasnt found a permanent suitor (youd figure that would tell you all you need to know about him) and 3. another forward who hadnt played a game in the premiership, and whose severely struggling with the physicality and pace of the league.

the midfield is just as abysmal; i wouldnt be suprised if we have the lowest output of goals from midfield in the permiership (13 as fas as i can remember; 8 for gilberto, hleb 2 flamini 2 rosicky 1; surely there has to be more than that isnt there?) i mean christ, paul f****g robinson has more league goals than fabregas, whose played more minutes than anyone on our team bar lehmann. and no one give me this s**t about him being unlucky; bad luck pops up in 2 or 3 games, not 31. the question has been asked repeatedly and still hasnt been answered adequately: what the hells the point of having playmakers when you have no one to finish those plays off?

i just find it absurd that the most important part of the game seems to be the part weve neglected the most and emphasised the least in recent years.

TheDawn is right Jazz.....Its like saying: the operation was a success- but the patient died. All the buildup play is pointless if it fails to lead up to putting the ball in the net which is after all the aim of the game. I'm sure YBF could reel off countless statistics about how many 10 yard side passes Hleb completed, but football is not like cricket or baseball. The only stat I look at is in the top corner, thats all that counts.

Athyera- the most depressing this for me is that we could see this coming all season. FFS Its happened for half the home games.

I hate to say it, but I agree

 

[Biggus]

I hate to say it, but I agree

Lose the hate Rednwhite. Its about opinions not people, sometimes we agree- sometimes not, but we're all Arsenal fans.I reserve hate for people who personally hurt me and mine.
Oh and ManU and Chel$ki.