Captain
Established Member
I'd take Djourou's consistency over Senderos' whatever everytime.
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Player Ratings - PL: Arsenal vs Watford | 14/10/06
- Thread starter kel varnsen
- Start date
- Replies 74
- Views 5,635
jester
Established Member
asajoseph said:
i just worry that with our high line, a mistake from senderos and thats it - with the rest - clichy, eboue, hoyte, gallas, toure, djourou - they're highly likely to recover or get back (you could say that the one next to him, toure, should get back to cover his mistakes). Like i said, its just one aspect of his game, but it is a worry that he's the only lacking in the back 4.
jester
Established Member
- Åñð®éw - said:
someone stole his smile
i suspect adebayor - why not eh? No-one seems to like him anyway
dublingunner
Established Member
Lehmann - 7.5 There when needed, we'll forgive him for that bad goal kick but deserves extra for getting up straight away after almost breaking the post in two!
Hoyte - 6.5 Thought he did ok but still looked a bit unsure of himself and had a dodgy cross or two.
Toure - 7 Solid overall, I thought he did have a couple of shaky moments though, bad clearances but was a threat to their goal, made one awesome block and had the audacity to shoot from 40 yards.
Djourou - 8 Admittedly I've only seen the match once, I'll be checking again but I have to disagree with some here, I thought he was the rock yesterday. Never made a mistake as far as I can recall.
Gallas - 7 Did enough but still seems less than 100% to me if you compare this performance to his ones at the start of the season.
Rosicky - 8 Unbelievable runner this boy, he's a goal threat and he makes great passes. Looks to be really enjoying himself, and has fit in perfectly. He showed he can play anywhere across the midfield except for Gilberto's position of course and I think he'll be a big star for us.
Fabregas - 8 He just keeps on doing it. Passes, runs, shots, flicks, sliding tackles. Another full 90 minutes. Any talk of him being tired should be ended right now.
Gilberto - 7.5 As per usual. Consistency personified.
Walcott - 7 Did well for his first start but did seem to become less involved as the game wore on. Had a great cut in and shot, excellent ball control and of course he's a bit pacy.
Adebayor - 7.5 He scored didn't he, he dragged oponents away, he provided a target. In other words, he did everything he's supposed to do.
Henry - 7.5 I reckon he hasn't looked at his best all season. He said it'll take him until October so fair enough. Did show some great skill and scored of course but at times his control let him down and played the odd loose ball.
Subs
Hleb - 8 Was a pain in Watford's ass when he came on. He's another player who is now fitting in so well.
van Persie - 6.5 Fairly quiet, one shot off target (although he was brought into midfield) and proved he's no defender.
Clichy - 7 Slotted right in, some nice challenges and runs. I just hope he doesn't go injuring himself any time soon.
Hoyte - 6.5 Thought he did ok but still looked a bit unsure of himself and had a dodgy cross or two.
Toure - 7 Solid overall, I thought he did have a couple of shaky moments though, bad clearances but was a threat to their goal, made one awesome block and had the audacity to shoot from 40 yards.
Djourou - 8 Admittedly I've only seen the match once, I'll be checking again but I have to disagree with some here, I thought he was the rock yesterday. Never made a mistake as far as I can recall.
Gallas - 7 Did enough but still seems less than 100% to me if you compare this performance to his ones at the start of the season.
Rosicky - 8 Unbelievable runner this boy, he's a goal threat and he makes great passes. Looks to be really enjoying himself, and has fit in perfectly. He showed he can play anywhere across the midfield except for Gilberto's position of course and I think he'll be a big star for us.
Fabregas - 8 He just keeps on doing it. Passes, runs, shots, flicks, sliding tackles. Another full 90 minutes. Any talk of him being tired should be ended right now.
Gilberto - 7.5 As per usual. Consistency personified.
Walcott - 7 Did well for his first start but did seem to become less involved as the game wore on. Had a great cut in and shot, excellent ball control and of course he's a bit pacy.
Adebayor - 7.5 He scored didn't he, he dragged oponents away, he provided a target. In other words, he did everything he's supposed to do.
Henry - 7.5 I reckon he hasn't looked at his best all season. He said it'll take him until October so fair enough. Did show some great skill and scored of course but at times his control let him down and played the odd loose ball.
Subs
Hleb - 8 Was a pain in Watford's ass when he came on. He's another player who is now fitting in so well.
van Persie - 6.5 Fairly quiet, one shot off target (although he was brought into midfield) and proved he's no defender.
Clichy - 7 Slotted right in, some nice challenges and runs. I just hope he doesn't go injuring himself any time soon.
asajoseph
Established Member
I'd consider it an assist if he'd got any kind of meaningful touch on the ball - as it is, he completely missed it. What credit is there in that?
No, of course not. And that's because for every pass Fabregas gives away, there are 4 or 5 that are insightful, intelligent, and dangerous. You get nothing of that from Adebayor.
Again, this is true. And it's always one of my biggest criticisms of the guy. But what you've missed is that Gilberto, like Rosicky and Fabregas and Henry and most of the other players on our side, provides a fairly significant upside that means you can overlook the mistakes that are inevitbale for any player, no matter how good.
It can be a factor, this is true. But actually watching the game and the specific incident should usually be enough to tell you whether or not it's the case - if a player's making a run, it's the passer's responsibility to make the pass that connects with that run, not expect your teammate to change direction and come close to pick up the ball. That's what Adebayor got wrong, several times on saturday.
patrick42uk
Established Member
thought ade was one of our better performers. in fact, if i had to do a rating he'd get a 7 along with fabregas, djourou, henry and toure and everyone else gets a 6. of course, like asa, i might be biased. i mean come on, he gave away the ball 4 or 5 times? so we are supposed to focus on this and forget some of the nicer touches/passing/link play he displayed during the game? then he makes a decent run for his goal and we are supposed to forget that too? even if he didnt get his head on the ball, which i think he did for the first and not the second, not being there would not have led to goals. he was a constant problem in the air to watford throughout that game. i do agree with asa though on one thing, everyone does sloppy/bad things in a game as well as good things. its a personal choice what you choose to focus on.
asajoseph
Established Member
It never really was the focus - in fact, it wasn't the giving the ball away part that I originally criticised, it was the four or five times his teammates made good runs for him and he sold them short by passing the ball too weakly. On top of that, he had times where he was let down by a weak first touch, and poor dribbling. It was the sum of what he did poorly (or not at all) that I care about, more than the individual instances.
Maybe that's what I've done, because apart from one acceptable one-two on the halfway line, and a nice crossfield ball up the left to a player (who specifically, I've forgotten), I really don't think there was that much in the way of nice link-up play, and that's by Adebayor's own standards, not those of a world-class striker. I recognise what Adebayor's good at, and when people say he's a 'good link-up striker', I do actually understand what they mean - he just wasn't doing it on saturday.
Nobody's forgetting it. I said before it wasn't a particularly amazing run - he went square for a striker through on goal, hardly rocket science, and something you'll see kids do in playgrounds - but he did everything he needed to and got the ball in the back of the net, so nothing to complain about there. The point, in bringing it up in the first place though, was that scoring that goal certainly does not mask the poorer all-round display. We would significantly have benefitted from having a striker up front with Henry on saturday who was more comfortable with the ball at his feet, someone who could pass or shoot well.
That's entirely debateable. Who's to say what would have happened if he hadn't been there? It's all if's and but's - fact is, he was there, he missed two headers, and it caught the defence off-guard perhaps. But then, if he hadn't been there and we'd have had another striker with a nicer touch and more skill there, maybe we'd have scored 3 goals in a completely different way. Maybe Watford would have missed the balls anyway. Maybe whoever else was there in Adebayor's place would have done exactly the same thing? Who knows?
Honestly though, if the sum of his performance was distracting the opposition and then missing the ball, whilst making one good but hardly challenging run, anyone who thinks he was amazing is using a different yardstick to judge him in comparison to the rest of our players. Maybe it's just me, but I expect a little bit more from Arsenal-quality strikers these days.
I fully expect him to be benched tomorrow anyway.
Captain
Established Member
Asa, I think you are underestimating the run he made for his goal.
He was on Watford's left back at the time which kept him wide and made the gap for Cesc to pass into. After that he curved his run in field and took the full back with him which gave Henry the space to run into.
He didn't just 'run square' for the pass, that's what Hleb did.
The rest is just a difference of opinion. for my money he was good on saturday but as I said it is irrelevent now.
He was on Watford's left back at the time which kept him wide and made the gap for Cesc to pass into. After that he curved his run in field and took the full back with him which gave Henry the space to run into.
He didn't just 'run square' for the pass, that's what Hleb did.
The rest is just a difference of opinion. for my money he was good on saturday but as I said it is irrelevent now.
eye4goal
Established Member
I watched the game and it was an OK performance. I agree with Asa about Adebayor. He can win headers and is good with running with the ball but for a big man he should hold the ball better and his touch and passing were average. In short Van Persie wont be worried with Ade's performance.
patrick42uk
Established Member
i gave him a 7, hardly amazing. but i firmly believe, as do others, that he was one of our better performers on the day because he made a difference. in what was in my opinion an average performance where we did enough. its your choice to think otherwise. its your choice to amplify the bad things and play down the good things. as i said, you can do that with any player.
of course he'll be benched tomorrow. that isnt some sort of punishment for him. he and rvp have been rotated all season. that will probably continue because they'v both shown they can make a difference. its clear that wenger trusts both to do a job. not to mention we'll probably play 4-5-1 where the choice becomes henry or ade for the central slot.
what they say about the quality of arsenal strikers now in relation to the past? i think we'v had better so i completely disagree that the bar all of a sudden has been raised for 'arsenal quality strikers these days'. i think the squad containing wiltord, bergkamp, kanu and henry were better.\
what i do like about our current bunch of strikers is there is a degree of balance there in that one's weakness is the other's strength.
of course he'll be benched tomorrow. that isnt some sort of punishment for him. he and rvp have been rotated all season. that will probably continue because they'v both shown they can make a difference. its clear that wenger trusts both to do a job. not to mention we'll probably play 4-5-1 where the choice becomes henry or ade for the central slot.
what they say about the quality of arsenal strikers now in relation to the past? i think we'v had better so i completely disagree that the bar all of a sudden has been raised for 'arsenal quality strikers these days'. i think the squad containing wiltord, bergkamp, kanu and henry were better.\
what i do like about our current bunch of strikers is there is a degree of balance there in that one's weakness is the other's strength.
asajoseph
Established Member
Captain said:
Yes, upon reflection, perhaps I am underestimating it a bit - he did come right accross the field to make himself available. However I'd still maintain that it wasn't anything particularly exceptional, park footballers make that kind of run all the time.
This was, although it's become that way, never supposed to be an exposition of why I don't rate Adebayor - originally, my point was that even by Adebayor's standards, he really wasn't that good on Saturday. Normally his passing and touch are better than what he came showed that day, and I don't think his goal is nearly enough to mask that.
goonerwarsh
Established Member
I think we're being a bit harsh on Adebayor at the moment. I quite like him, I don't think he's one of the world's best players but I think he gives us something different and some physical presence up front. I think the team is operating pretty well why are we choosing to focus on negatives?
Were picking up the points chaps and playing well without hitting top gear yet, so it's happy days. There's lots of healthy competition within the team and everyone seems to be enjoying the football
Were picking up the points chaps and playing well without hitting top gear yet, so it's happy days. There's lots of healthy competition within the team and everyone seems to be enjoying the football
RammiXP
Well-Known Member
This Ade situation is a prime example of how we as football fans see the game very different. I thought ade was brilliant on saturday as mentioned in my ratings. He seemed to be always available, finding space and kept thing simple apart from one little flick he a tempted that went wrong.
While i can see where your coming from Asa i think your being very harsh, i think your being to critical of his performance and he was clearly one of the better players on the park. Also comparing Fab to Ade is stupid (not that you did someone else did) As fabs job is to be creative and feed people with passes. Ade job is firstly to score goals, which he did and 2nd to provide some meaningful contributions while in the attacking zone, once again he did.
You could argue he could do more so on and so forth but then im sorry you could say that about everyone. Cesc could have created a few more chances, Henry should have scored more goals (that glaring miss in the first half), Djourou should not sliced the kick which almost led to a goal for watford. all these things should not happen and players can always do more but in reflection Ade did well conisdering he has not played a game for us since Man U and also for the reasons i have listed above.
While i can see where your coming from Asa i think your being very harsh, i think your being to critical of his performance and he was clearly one of the better players on the park. Also comparing Fab to Ade is stupid (not that you did someone else did) As fabs job is to be creative and feed people with passes. Ade job is firstly to score goals, which he did and 2nd to provide some meaningful contributions while in the attacking zone, once again he did.
You could argue he could do more so on and so forth but then im sorry you could say that about everyone. Cesc could have created a few more chances, Henry should have scored more goals (that glaring miss in the first half), Djourou should not sliced the kick which almost led to a goal for watford. all these things should not happen and players can always do more but in reflection Ade did well conisdering he has not played a game for us since Man U and also for the reasons i have listed above.
