Arsenal v West Ham. EPL Sat Jan 31st 2009 15:00

[JGooner]

The booing isn't surprising and will, I assure you, get much worse. It is unsustainable to have such a huge gap between the ambitions of the fans and those of the manager/board.

The fact that our performance today was (by our standards) pretty good and we still failed to create more than two or three proper chances, at home against a mediocre side, underlines the reality that the quality just isn't there. Denilson-Diaby-Song are the worst midfielders this club has seen since the Jensen-Morrow-Selley days. The fact that a player as ordinary as Adebayor is on such a huge contract on the basis of one good season makes our claims to fiscal discipline look hollow. Eboue is a sick joke of a footballer, though it's true that his career has basically been vandalised by being forced to play outside his natural RB position.

And all of this, which is itself frustrating to fans, is then compounded by the garbage we have to hear from Wenger - the deluded fantasies about his squad's potential, the endless sour-faced whining about not getting enough credit for hovering around 4th place while playing football of deteriorating quality and turning a profit.

I keep saying it, but the level of frustratiom among fans at the ground is palpable and growing. It is a state of affairs that is simply not sustainable indefinitely.

 

[outlaw_member]

Diaby


Denilson

So much for Diaby being a lazy bugger, who is unable to win the ball.

 

[outlaw_member]

“We are not far away but now we have a bit of time now the game is over until Tuesday night. Monday night is the deadline so we’ll see what can be done in 24 hours. With the experience I have, anything can happen in a transfer.”

Monday night is not the deadline, Mr Arsène Wenger.

 

[tactica442]

Diaby had a good game against West Ham. It's the lack of creativy and Ade not being clinical enough led to the boring draw.

I had noticed one thing a few times. When Arsenal attacking players were about receiving the ball, they often chose not to turn and face the approcching marker, even they were not being closely marked or their neck being breathed upon. Nasri can easily judge the coming ball and the relative position of his markers and flexibily choose whether to actively turn with the ball first time or passively face the marker with his back. Robin can do this as well. As for the others, I saw little of this from them. I think Diaby is capable of doing this but he doesn't do that often enough. Anyway just my microanalytical mumbling. Take a pinch of salt all you want.

 

[Zico]

The biggest thing that struck me watching from home is that from what I could see there was very little constructive off-the-ball movement. Whenever a player had the ball, there were very few options in the way of players trying to move into space. Is there anyone who was at the Grove who can confirm if this was the case? If we are not moving off-the-ball, I cannot see us having any hope of destabilizing opposition defenses.

 

[outlaw_member]

This has been a flaw in our game for years now. People like to revise history, but even the Rosicky-Fabregas-Flamini-Hleb midfield was incredibly frustrating. How often did we find ourselves on the edge of the box, pass-pass-pass to no avail, and than send in a cross for Adebayor to head in? The lack of off the ball movement has been killing our creativity for years, and it's also no surprise that our counter attacks have also become useless. It is absolutely imperative that a runner plays upfront, when you have creative players. You need someone who is looking to get in behind the CB's at all times. Neither Ade or RVP do this, which is why our midfield have very little options. Only one of the two should be playing, alongside either one of Eduardo, Vela or Walcott.

 

[Cruisio]

Also I couldn't believe how much hate and stick Eboue got today from the crowed, literally each time he touched the ball I had people all around me saying ' watch him f**k it up', 'don't pass to him', ' ooh f**k not him' and f'n this and f'n that and there was massive cheer when he was taken off. I been to watch Arsenal many times over the years and this is the 1st time I see a single player getting this much stick, not even opposition player. It got to point where I actually felt sorry for Eboue, because let face it if there is anyone to blame its Wenger for consistently playing out of position when even a f****g blind man will tell you his been useless there.

Yeah its fu*king annoying beyond belief. Sad that these days, whether your in a pub or the ground, its seems inevitable that youll be surrounded by a bunch of smug sh*ts who think its cool to just shout out bullshit for 90 minutes.

I'm sorry, but the reason why Eboue gets as much stick as he does is because of about the 80% of time he's played, and played s**t in an Arsenal shirt. Whats funny is that at the start of todays game he actually was playing ok, and the people around me and myself were making ironic jokes ("Pele", calling him the "danger man" because west ham kept fouling him) but were egging him on none the less.

Then he lost the ball in the corner trying to pass to Ade I think it was and then after that he went back to the joke of a footballer he often diplays himself to be. He stopped tracking back, he stopped picking out any of our men, he stopped making tackles, he became a passenger. THATS when he started to get the abuse that he recieved. Atleast thats how I saw it from where I was sitting

 

[Biggus]

Also I couldn't believe how much hate and stick Eboue got today from the crowed, literally each time he touched the ball I had people all around me saying ' watch him f**k it up', 'don't pass to him', ' ooh f**k not him' and f'n this and f'n that and there was massive cheer when he was taken off. I been to watch Arsenal many times over the years and this is the 1st time I see a single player getting this much stick, not even opposition player. It got to point where I actually felt sorry for Eboue, because let face it if there is anyone to blame its Wenger for consistently playing out of position when even a f****g blind man will tell you his been useless there.

In fairness, Eboue didn't have a bad game- he certainly was not the worst of them, I mean what does Denilson actually do?

I despise the mob persecution of Eboue, as these bunch of cowards are too afraid to boo the real guilty party- Wenger- who after all the buck has to stop with. :roll: The sooner people face up to the fact that the myth of St Arsène the infallible is shattered- the better.

 

[DOUBLE-YOU]

The booing isn't surprising and will, I assure you, get much worse. It is unsustainable to have such a huge gap between the ambitions of the fans and those of the manager/board.

The fact that our performance today was (by our standards) pretty good and we still failed to create more than two or three proper chances, at home against a mediocre side, underlines the reality that the quality just isn't there. Denilson-Diaby-Song are the worst midfielders this club has seen since the Jensen-Morrow-Selley days. The fact that a player as ordinary as Adebayor is on such a huge contract on the basis of one good season makes our claims to fiscal discipline look hollow. Eboue is a sick joke of a footballer, though it's true that his career has basically been vandalised by being forced to play outside his natural RB position.

And all of this, which is itself frustrating to fans, is then compounded by the garbage we have to hear from Wenger - the deluded fantasies about his squad's potential, the endless sour-faced whining about not getting enough credit for hovering around 4th place while playing football of deteriorating quality and turning a profit.

I keep saying it, but the level of frustratiom among fans at the ground is palpable and growing. It is a state of affairs that is simply not sustainable indefinitely.

your statement is so funny. jensen - morrow - selley days huh? there is one other player you left out...ray parlour. yes the legend we call the romford pele was part of that midfield and he was awful. no. really awful. it's funny how people remember what they want. if any of you went to arsenal games at the time, you would remember selley was actual a better player.
i know we can't live on excuses but please give these players time to develop. admittedly i am not a fan of song, but with denilson and diaby you can see with time they will develop into good players. i remember paul davis went through the same thing with the fans. once we decide we don't like a player then that's it. they are always ****no matter how well they perform. it's a poor attitude to take.
before last season flamini was also a boo boy, now we miss him more than anything. for the sake of the club, give these players a chance. you can see they have no confidence playing at home, because those who only started watching arsenal after 2004 give them a hard time.

 

[kel varnsen]

what are you talking about? all diaby done was play forward passes.
who got the assist for RvP on wednesday?

regardless of today's match and debate, what the hell kind of argument is this? diaby had a good game today, because he had a superb assist on wednesday?

 

[DOUBLE-YOU]

what are you talking about? all diaby done was play forward passes.
who got the assist for RvP on wednesday?

regardless of today's match and debate, what the hell kind of argument is this? diaby had a good game today, because he had a superb assist on wednesday?

kel you've lost me. my response was because someone said diaby didn't play any forward passes. the assist for RvP was me giving an example of an affective forward pass he has made.

 

[kel varnsen]

of course i am, as we try to play the same way with diaby and denilson in central midfield as we did with cesc and flamini there. in the context of possession based football, which is exactly what wenger wants at the moment, then that is the basis of the discussion. furthermore, that means diaby and denilson failed today. again. as usual.

We do play the same way, but the roles of the CM's slightly differ from that of Fabregas-Flamini. Neither Diaby or Denilson play the role of the dictator, because they aren't advanced enough on the field, nor do they have the skills for it. Due to circumstances, we no longer have a creative player in CM, therefore, we've had to change our setup in order to compliment the current personel.

and that is my point, vis-a-vis this discussion. diaby and denilson simply lack the abilities to execute the tasks handed to them. now, i think they are ****e regardless of context. useless footballers, not capable of really anything useful. what the hell does either of them really offer tbh? i challenge anyone to come up with a half decent answer that i can't crush and refute in 30 seconds...

 

[kel varnsen]

what are you talking about? all diaby done was play forward passes.
who got the assist for RvP on wednesday?

regardless of today's match and debate, what the hell kind of argument is this? diaby had a good game today, because he had a superb assist on wednesday?

kel you've lost me. my response was because someone said diaby didn't play any forward passes. the assist for RvP was me giving an example of an affective forward pass he has made.

i thought we were talking about today's performances. i found it odd to bring up the match against everton. in which, btw, diaby was ****. as usual.

 

[j'nuh]

Also I couldn't believe how much hate and stick Eboue got today from the crowed, literally each time he touched the ball I had people all around me saying ' watch him f**k it up', 'don't pass to him', ' ooh f**k not him' and f'n this and f'n that and there was massive cheer when he was taken off. I been to watch Arsenal many times over the years and this is the 1st time I see a single player getting this much stick, not even opposition player. It got to point where I actually felt sorry for Eboue, because let face it if there is anyone to blame its Wenger for consistently playing out of position when even a f****g blind man will tell you his been useless there.

Yeah its fu*king annoying beyond belief. Sad that these days, whether your in a pub or the ground, its seems inevitable that youll be surrounded by a bunch of smug sh*ts who think its cool to just shout out bullshit for 90 minutes.

I'm sorry, but the reason why Eboue gets as much stick as he does is because of about the 80% of time he's played, and played s**t in an Arsenal shirt. Whats funny is that at the start of todays game he actually was playing ok, and the people around me and myself were making ironic jokes ("Pele", calling him the "danger man" because west ham kept fouling him) but were egging him on none the less.

Then he lost the ball in the corner trying to pass to Ade I think it was and then after that he went back to the joke of a footballer he often diplays himself to be. He stopped tracking back, he stopped picking out any of our men, he stopped making tackles, he became a passenger. THATS when he started to get the abuse that he recieved. Atleast thats how I saw it from where I was sitting

Its comments like this that just strengthen my beleif that the Eboue boo-ers are a bunch of f*cking knobjockeys.

1. Just saying a player is 'sh*t' doesnt cut it for me. Neither does coming out with bullshit statistics. Neither does does that 'passenger' argument - if that makes any sense then why did no one boo Vela?

2. Even if i was convinced that Eboue was as sh*t as everyone makes out, it would still go nowhere near justifying booing him. The fact that you thought you could do so shows how clueless you really are.

 

[DOUBLE-YOU]

kel, diaby had a good game against west ham. yes he was poor against everton, but he did get an assist which offsets the performance somewhat. he played well coming on against cardiff too. i think because you don't rate him, you think he plays **** no matter how well he performs.

 

[j'nuh]

of course i am, as we try to play the same way with diaby and denilson in central midfield as we did with cesc and flamini there. in the context of possession based football, which is exactly what wenger wants at the moment, then that is the basis of the discussion. furthermore, that means diaby and denilson failed today. again. as usual.

We do play the same way, but the roles of the CM's slightly differ from that of Fabregas-Flamini. Neither Diaby or Denilson play the role of the dictator, because they aren't advanced enough on the field, nor do they have the skills for it. Due to circumstances, we no longer have a creative player in CM, therefore, we've had to change our setup in order to compliment the current personel.

and that is my point, vis-a-vis this discussion. diaby and denilson simply lack the abilities to execute the tasks handed to them. now, i think they are s***e regardless of context. useless footballers, not capable of really anything useful. what the hell does either of them really offer tbh? i challenge anyone to come up with a half decent answer that i can't crush and refute in 30 seconds...

You really struggle with the whole concept of subjectivity dont you?

Youre an armchair fan, just like the rest of us. You have no authority on this topic. Get used to it, and while youre at it, chill the f*ck out.

 

[outlaw_member]

and that is my point, vis-a-vis this discussion. diaby and denilson simply lack the abilities to execute the tasks handed to them. now, i think they are s***e regardless of context. useless footballers, not capable of really anything useful. what the hell does either of them really offer tbh? i challenge anyone to come up with a half decent answer that i can't crush and refute in 30 seconds...

Other than Cesc, we have never had a CM who was capable of doing what your asking for. Your gripe should lie with Wenger for not having more creative CM's. Unfortunately, those type of players are not easy to come by, especially if they are going to be Cesc's backup.

 

[DOUBLE-YOU]

so tell me kel, at what standard have you played football? to be honest you sound like one of those talkers who always criticise but have never played before.

can you name me the midfielders playing in the premier league who do what you expect of them.

 

[Biggus]

1. Just saying a player is 'sh*t' doesnt cut it for me. Neither does coming out with bullshit statistics. Neither does does that 'passenger' argument - if that makes any sense then why did no one boo Vela?

2. Even if i was convinced that Eboue was as sh*t as everyone makes out, it would still go nowhere near justifying booing him. The fact that you thought you could do so shows how clueless you really are.

Agree with this, Eboue tried a few good things today, and as I say was certainly not the worst of them. The cowards who booed him, but not St Carlos' pathetic dive speak volumes about the brain power of the mob. It's only in here when the anger and emotion subsides that we can calmly discuss and apportion blame for this latest fiasco.

 

[Double_H]

i though our Midfield did good
its Just Ade
when teams defend with 10 men and you play a passing game your FWDs need to play with one touch . and Ade have a bad first touch and he doesnt want to pass the ball ot he pass it waaaaay back so he can get the ball back
ive always said that about ade
just watch him he doesnt pass the ball to the best position . he pass it to the player who can gives him the ball back

Milan please Buy him 20M will do