Mesut Özil: He came, he saw, he conquered

[Jury]

For the record, and for clarity, I absolutely did not think he would come good, but he has. So I completely stand corrected on that! But that's as 'wrong' as I've been imo. All the rest is seagulls following the trawler of truth

 

[Jury]

As far as form goes I don't really see the similarity at all. One thing I'd say is there's no need to **** on Alexis to help big up Özil. They're 2 of the best players in the league, be happy we have them.

This is another AM phenomenon. It might even be a football forum thing. It's in its early days of study...

 

[Furious]

As far as form goes I don't really see the similarity at all. One thing I'd say is there's no need to **** on Alexis to help big up Özil. They're 2 of the best players in the league, be happy we have them.

Maybe I should make a curve diagram to make it clear. Noted for further discussions.

I'm happy bro, very happy indeed. Love them both to bits.

 

[blaze_of_glory]

I actually think the Alexis and Özil comparison is pretty spot on in terms of their second seasons here. Both started it slowly by their own standards due to being exhausted from playing a key role in a national side that won a major tournament, and then both got injured around the same time.

Özil came back better and I expect Alexis will too.

 

[fc honka]

I have always liked Özil a lot, since 2008 Werder times I have followed his performances. Even if I am fan, I have to agree that only this season he is playing for Arsenal like I hoped he would have from the beginning.

There is no question that also his performances now are a lot better than in the end of last season, even if he already performed quite well that time. So I have to agree to those posters that say, that this season we see a lot improved Özil. Actually when I watched the Sunderland compilation earlier in this thread, I think in that game he played with the same energy and passion, which is consistent in his game this season. But it did not happen very often in his first season.

I do not know what was the biggest reason for his form drop in the first season, but he might have underestimated this league and the physicality of it. There might have maybe been also some personal issues outside football?

The injury last season was a blessing. He was really tired after the World Cup and with zero preseason the failure was evident. But he made himself stronger during injury and I would even guess he made some changes in his eating and resting. Those are small things that can make big changes.

Now he is able to run for the full 90 min and its really a joy to see. I do not remember that I ever have witnessed a game like against Bournemouth with somebody creating so many chances for his team. And I have watched football since 1970.

 

[USArsenalFan716]

I'm very happy that Özil is playing to the best of his ability now, it's a real vindication for me who, along with a few others in here, was one of the few people who correctly pointed out that the level he was playing at in the past two seasons was unacceptable. His current form proves this.

I think his semi-retirement to Turkey will has been postponed for many more years.

At least we all can finally agree that he's a world class player and crucial to this team.

Looking through all the posts, I bolded the kind of statement I have issue with more than anything.

NO, you weren't correct (because it's an opinion). My OPINION (along with a bunch of others) was that he was at an acceptable level the past couple seasons (especially after coming back from injury).....I would have still paid 42 million for his form after coming back from injury (possibly before). Saying I am wrong to have that opinion really annoys me.

No point going into this debate again, his chances that he created and influence on our attack was worth it to me, even if he wasn't getting the eye popping stats... I understand it wasn't enough for everyone. That's where we differ.

I love that he has even added more to his game this season. The great players find a way to keep getting better which I think he has done. Doesn't mean I wouldn't have still taken him any day in his form from last season.

 

[celestis]

Both started like fire! Hardly comparable.

His first 6 months were of a damn high standard , assists and goals .

 

[Godwin1]

At least we all can finally agree that he's a world class player and crucial to this team.

Looking through all the posts, I bolded the kind of statement I have issue with more than anything.

NO, you weren't correct (because it's an opinion). My OPINION (along with a bunch of others) was that he was at an acceptable level the past couple seasons (especially after coming back from injury).....I would have still paid 42 million for his form after coming back from injury (possibly before). Saying I am wrong to have that opinion really annoys me.

No point going into this debate again, his chances that he created and influence on our attack was worth it to me, even if he wasn't getting the eye popping stats... I understand it wasn't enough for everyone. That's where we differ.

I love that he has even added more to his game this season. The great players find a way to keep getting better which I think he has done. Doesn't mean I wouldn't have still taken him any day in his form from last season.

That whole post was an opinion mate, I'm not going to start putting "imo" after everything I write

 

[USArsenalFan716]

That whole post was an opinion mate, I'm not going to start putting "imo" after everything I write

That's not what you said. Obviously everything here is pretty much an opinion, but you stated it as a fact. You used the word correct. Don't use that word when stating an opinion if you don't want me to call you on it.

Ugh. I don't care if you thought he wasn't worth it... When you act like anyone is an idiot for thinking otherwise I don't care for that

 

[Godwin1]

That's not what you said. Obviously everything here is pretty much an opinion, but you stated it as a fact. You used the word correct. Don't use that word when stating an opinion if you don't want me to call you on it.

That doesn't make any sense mate.

Ugh. I don't care if you thought he wasn't worth it... When you act like anyone is an idiot for thinking otherwise I don't care for that

Wasn't my intention and I don't think other people are idiots on this forum. Don't think my posts are that different from most of the other in this thread in that respect.

 

[Sun Ra]

And welcome @Sun Ra ! It's not always like this mate. Honestly! This one will rage on I think

Thanks! Seems like Özil does cause a tiny bit of controversy

 

[africe]

This public shaming is better than Ramsey 13/14

 

[sonerb81]

There were moments when things were being made far more difficult for Özil to rediscover his best, by being made to play wide. None of us liked the idea, and it was horrible to see. We all wanted him back at No.10. As for not having runners: again, would have aided him to have players running in front of him, but that wasn't solely the problem.

He's since made a mockery of all those claims anyway, because he's since proven that his form and determination to make a difference in the last third were the problem more than anything. People have cited all sorts of explanations, but then say he's the same player!

.

You are just making excuses.

Instead of throwing cliché phrases around why don't you give us facts? Tell us what is so different between Özil's first year at Arsenal and his current year play.

Talk about distance covered. Talk about his pass accuracy. Talk about chances created. Talk about his movement with AND without the ball. What is so different? Please give us FACTS.

I have been watching Mesut since the first year he started playing for Madrid. No less than 15 games per season. Watching him currently play, I don't see "significant" improvements in his game that would warrant people to praise him so much. Only difference this season is that he is a bit stronger. That's it. Nothing else. He doesn't have this "determination" that you speak off specific to this season.

To me, the difference is that his key passes are being converted a bit better this season. As a result people like you are praising him now vs bashing him when his teammates were incompetent to say the least or he was forced to play wide. I would LOVE to see his complete stats including key chances created since his Madrid days. Let's see the conversion rate between Madrid strikers and Arsenal strikers. What was he doing so different at Madrid to be viewed as world class and what he did wrong at Arsenal to be considered waste of money? Or is it his Arsenal teammates? Even though Mesut has 16 assists as of now, Walcott and Giroud are still missing incredible chances created by Mesut. Only a fraction of those would have been missed by Ronaldo and Benzema. In fact, I wish T. Henry was still playing at Arsenal-at his current age!, Özil would have easily be at 20-25 assist range by now.

 

[Jury]

@sonerb81

I think the onus is on you to come up with some stats, regarding how many of his chances created are being converted, compared to some other time--not me. And even then, they're sure to be subjective.

And if you think he's the same player now as the one before his injury, then good for you. For your information, our strikers haven't changed much since he's been here; it's still Giroud mainly, so haven't the foggiest what you're talking about there. And there you were saying I was the one making excuses. Your whole post reads like one big 'excuse' tbf. In the meantime, read some of these.
http://www.arsenal.com/news/news-archive/20151109/-wenger-Özil-has-become-a-leader
http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/arsenal-Arsène-wenger-applauds-mesut-Özil-improving-his-game-1534110
http://www.fourfourtwo.com/news/wenger-hails-complete-athlete-Özil#:SSVx6g4K3baIyA

But yeah, contrary to what most have seen with their eyes, and what the manager and Özil himself have said, he's the same player. No, actually, he isn't, and if that makes anyone 'wrong', then so be it, but you're doing it to yourself. In your quest for total 'victory', you'll ruin it all and end up with nada. Take it and run!

I'm done here.

 

[pigge]

You are just making excuses.

Instead of throwing cliché phrases around why don't you give us facts? Tell us what is so different between Özil's first year at Arsenal and his current year play.

Talk about distance covered. Talk about his pass accuracy. Talk about chances created. Talk about his movement with AND without the ball. What is so different? Please give us FACTS.

I have been watching Mesut since the first year he started playing for Madrid. No less than 15 games per season. Watching him currently play, I don't see "significant" improvements in his game that would warrant people to praise him so much. Only difference this season is that he is a bit stronger. That's it. Nothing else. He doesn't have this "determination" that you speak off specific to this season.

To me, the difference is that his key passes are being converted a bit better this season. As a result people like you are praising him now vs bashing him when his teammates were incompetent to say the least or he was forced to play wide. I would LOVE to see his complete stats including key chances created since his Madrid days. Let's see the conversion rate between Madrid strikers and Arsenal strikers. What was he doing so different at Madrid to be viewed as world class and what he did wrong at Arsenal to be considered waste of money? Or is it his Arsenal teammates? Even though Mesut has 16 assists as of now, Walcott and Giroud are still missing incredible chances created by Mesut. Only a fraction of those would have been missed by Ronaldo and Benzema. In fact, I wish T. Henry was still playing at Arsenal-at his current age!, Özil would have easily be at 20-25 assist range by now.

So.. how many times has he had 16 assists in a league by new year when he had benzema and ronaldo as strikers? Please link.

 

[Trilly]

Here. Read the whole page and the next few... Don't let people cherrypick posts. Read what one guy says at the bottom of the page!
#thebiggerpicture

https://arsenal-mania.com/forum/threads/mesut-Özil-he-came-he-saw-he-conquered.28040/page-120

I see Özil has become the new scapegoat, probably because Ramsey didn't start. Pretty much half of the team including him was poor yesterday and our manager makes a lot of our players look worse than they really are.

Özil hasn't gotten worse as a player since he came here there's only one person to blame for that. We signed a counter attack master but play crap slow football, the only other top class player we have is Sanchez despite there being no players in Europe who could improve us.

I'm not defending how poor he was yesterday but the scapegoating here is silly. Our manager has no game plan it's no surprise a lot of good players (Ramsey, Özil, Cazorla especially) tend to look crap more often that not.

Ideally we send Özil out on a two year loan while we fix the glaring holes in our squad and game plan then we can sign him back as the 'cherry on top' player that he should have been. I have no idea what Wenger's plan is these days.

Been defending my boy from day one. #TrillyIsSafe

 

[Iceman10]

@Trilly

Almost safe, but not perfect IMO. A manager manages a player by educating them and getting buy-in to a long-term vision of how they want that player to develop, and how they are part of the overall project. This is particularly the case relatively soon into a squad rebuilding project (after so much selling).

From Özil quotes it is pretty clear that AW did a good job in explaining the overall vision. There would never be a need to loan a player out while other pieces were put together. Özil still needed to adjust and adapt to the PL. Even if you had all the same players theoretically transferred from Real Madrid there would still need to be adjustment to the PL from La Liga.

Other than that, pretty much spot on. lol.

 

[Jury]

Fecking new tag. Someone will accuse me of saying I thought Özil wasn't world class now...

 

[Trilly]

@Trilly

Almost safe, but not perfect IMO. A manager manages a player by educating them and getting buy-in to a long-term vision of how they want that player to develop, and how they are part of the overall project. This is particularly the case relatively soon into a squad rebuilding project (after so much selling).

From Özil quotes it is pretty clear that AW did a good job in explaining the overall vision. There would never be a need to loan a player out while other pieces were put together. Özil still needed to adjust and adapt to the PL. Even if you had all the same players theoretically transferred from Real Madrid there would still need to be adjustment to the PL from La Liga.

Other than that, pretty much spot on. lol.

Not sure what I was smoking when I said that two year loan.

Must have been a metaphor of some sort but I have no idea what I meant there.

 

[Mastadon]

Anyone who thinks he was world class over the last 2 seasons has very low standards.