Sevilla V Arsenal - Tuesday November 27 - 7.45pm

[DC Gunner]

Speaking of Swiss CB, are we getting Djourou back this year !? ever !?

I did not watch the match in Full, but count my vote as a Zero for the Swiss Cygan [this is why he probably shaved his head, so he can 100% emulate him].

Regarding Eduardo, I think Wenger wants him to become a better passer [within this system] as well.

I personally don't think this is a momentum breaker perse, but we seriously should have played an all attack team if the result does not matter much.

I am worried about Cesc, updates are welcome anytime, I am beginning to fear [I am not there yet though] that without him, we would be like Manure without the diving Portuguese.

 

[Dragon181]

This game was so frustrating that I had to go play some FIFA 08 games online to relieve my frustration. And playing frustrated only made my decision-making worse (I fell from being ranked 500s to 700s in a few hours). :evil:

But this game really gave a good indication of where this team is at the moment.

1) Almunia, who has performed admirable during the season, really needs good defensive help. If his defenders do their jobs, then he should be fine saving the occasional shot from distance. If they don't, he can't pull off an 'out-of-nowhere' save that prevents the goal. He's shown that in the past, and he's shown it again today. It's not a knock on him, I'm just pointing out his limitations while agreeing that he has performed well so far.

2) Following up with what I said above, the first line of defense is good, but the second line has a lot of cracks. Traore is not yet ready to take over if Clichy is injured. He shows a lot of promise, but got manhandled today. If Eboue stays as a RW and Hoyte is the second choice RB, I'm worried. He doesn't instill confidence with his play. And Senderos... :roll: And who knows how Djorou will play (as I've heard he's done badly for Birmingham).

3) Like the defense, the midfield (which seemed like it was full of promising players ready to step into starting roles) is only about 1/2 covered. Diarra can take over from Matty, and Eboue and whoever else takes RW (Theo, Rosicky, Hleb) are fine, but Eduardo cannot play the left wing, and Denilson still needs some time to develop into the great player everyone knows he will be.

4) Unsurprisingly, the forwards are the strongest link. With Ade, RVP, Bendtner, Eduardo, and Walcott, I don't think Le Boss will need to buy a new striker in the next 10 years, unless one of these players leaves (likely) or their forms dip radically.

Overall, it seems like the positions that were in need of help before are probably the same positions that still need help (a winger, a CB), unless the younger players step up and show their ability. This game was painful to watch and showed how much the team needs a true LW (or at least someone who helps the LB cover). With Alves and Navas out there, and Traore getting destroyed with no help from Eduardo, it just screams 'weak link'. I wonder what Wenger was thinking.

 

[USgoonergirl]

All the big boys are beatable though noone looks all dominant like in the bast infact our best defence is as good if not more so then most of them so I think we can get results against them.

Again, why make life harder for ourselfs? Forget about who we can face in the next round, we should have finished first. Period.

Why?

I could easily have said: we had to qualify. Period.

It's about your intentions. Finishing second is like showing weakness to your rivals. Instead of making a statement to the rest of Europe you do the opposite. This season, the top teams in Europe will all realsitically finish first, and that is no coincidence. If we want to be up with them then its best to finish first as well.

maybe we made the statement we dont care if we finish second, we think we are a good enough team to beat anyone?

anyways its too early to worry about who we will play, so much can happen between now and when the knockout round begins.

 

[DC Gunner]

So which seed one will we be getting, Inter or Barca !?

 

[Dragon181]

So which seed one will we be getting, Inter or Barca !?

Ouch

But I still think a full side would beat them all

Don't let one loss dampen an otherwise amazing season. Besides we were playing with the 2nd team out there.

 

[DC Gunner]

So which seed one will we be getting, Inter or Barca !?

Ouch

But I still think a full side would beat them all

Don't let one loss dampen an otherwise amazing season. Besides we were playing with the 2nd team out there.

I am not in a panic mode at all, but I am a little annoyed, winning the group is vital to make the fixtures a bit easier.

Now, imagine we get a tough team, the first leg would be after playing Blackburn [and a cup game I think, but not sure], and the second leg would be coming off playing Aston Villa.

Let's hope for the best.

 

[USgoonergirl]

So which seed one will we be getting, Inter or Barca !?

Ouch

But I still think a full side would beat them all

Don't let one loss dampen an otherwise amazing season. Besides we were playing with the 2nd team out there.

I am not in a panic mode at all, but I am a little annoyed, winning the group is vital to make the fixtures a bit easier.

Now, imagine we get a tough team, the first leg would be after playing Blackburn [and a cup game I think, but not sure], and the second leg would be coming off playing Aston Villa.

Let's hope for the best.

it would be a big game no matter who we play though, the only worry for me is that we have the second game away now.

 

[USgoonergirl]

So which seed one will we be getting, Inter or Barca !?

Ouch

But I still think a full side would beat them all

Don't let one loss dampen an otherwise amazing season. Besides we were playing with the 2nd team out there.

I am not in a panic mode at all, but I am a little annoyed, winning the group is vital to make the fixtures a bit easier.

Now, imagine we get a tough team, the first leg would be after playing Blackburn [and a cup game I think, but not sure], and the second leg would be coming off playing Aston Villa.

Let's hope for the best.

sorry double post

 

[celestis]

In the end it was a chance for Wenger to see how some of the rest of the squad react to adversity . This is pretty much as bad as it gets as far as defensive performances.

 

[KingReyes]

Seriously you guys need to calm down.
One bloody defeat with a 'B' team and it seems like it's the end of the world!

It was always going to be a tough game anyway as Sevilla are a good team and because we were resting half of our first team.

Our young players got the chance to play in a CL game and that's the biggest picture here. It's a good opportunity for them and I don't believe for one second Wenger didn't think about losing this game. He knew it was going to be tough for us.

But why play such a weak team? Its borderline neglence. Sevilla are one of the best teams in Europe and you play a Carling Cup team? Its almost laughable. Its like shooting yourself in the foot. Ask any team in Europe if they would rather finish first or second everyone will say the former. Its not the first time Wenger makes these mistakes either. If he did it properly, he could have rested players for the Steau match, but I bet you we will play a strong team because Wenger will still want to finish first. Does my head in.

Im all for giving players a chance and experience but not at the expense of our CL chances.

We need to wrap Gallas in cotton wool, because having a good decemeber and January will mainly be based on his fitness.

Stop being such a drama queen.

Wenger took a gamble to give the youngsters experience and we ended up losing the game. You speak about playing our best side last night, what divine right do we have that we would have won if they we played our best side? What makes you think we wouldn't have lost anyways?

And whats with this "We'll finish second and **** up our chances"? If we are good enough to win this competition then we will have to play the best teams eventually. We finished first in the 05/06 season and who did we get in the knockouts? Real Madrid, not some average pub side from Eastern Europe. if we want to win this comp we will need to beat the best sides whether its in the final or earlier stages.

You also talk about this "If we lose then we'll just keep on losing" like what we did last year against Blackburn and PSV. Thats because we were simply not good enough, especially mentally. If this team falters just because they lost to Seville then we are just simply not good enough, plain and simple. Not because Wenger decided to rest some players against Seville.

 

[USgooner]

^^^ phenomenal.

 

[ibby]

Yesterday's match was terrible. The moment I saw the team sheet I thought, ****.

As I said previously, Traore had his worst games in an Arsenal shirt, but it wasn't his fault. Sevilla have the best attacking right sided players in the world in Jesus and Dani. Leaving Traore exposed to that kind of punishment is unacceptable. The amount of times Sevilla had him on a one on one was scary, every time they attacked they looked like scoring. Wenger should have had someone playing at LM who is a little more defensive, Flamini would have been perfect, Eduardo is useless at defending.

Now moving on to Gilberto. He was poor, match practice or not. I have never seen a worse performance from him, his passing, decision making and tackling all not up to scratch today. Sevilla dominated every area of the pitch and that was no thanks to him. Have a nice time in Turin Gilberto.

Senderos is utter ****. I have stuck up for him so many times previously but now is his time to move on. He is the excat defender we don't need, slow, useless in the air (although that is supposed to be his strength) and clumsy. Luis Fabiano absolutely killed Senderos today in every aspect. I was against buying anyone in January but now I have changed my view, we HAVE to buy a central defender, I don't want to go into January/February relying on Senderos.

Hoyte, what the heck was he playing at, going forward he was terrible, defending he was even worse. When Sagna came on there was a massive improvement in our play. This performance showed how important full backs are to our play.

Now Arsène Wenger, when will he learn that Arsenal play a ****ING 442, he got tactically outplayed many times this season but his subs came and rescued him. 442 Wenger, not a moronic 451 whatever it is.

Worst thing is, Sevilla beat us at our own game, playing good football

Few plus points were, Eboue and Bendtner. Eboue looked dangerous every time he touched the ball but he has to quit falling over and looking silly.

 

[Zico]

I think that pointing to winning against Real Madrid two years ago and losing against PSV last year as evidence that we need to play a top team is a bit misguided.

As Alfonso has said (100 times), we should have aimed to play a weaker team; the likes of Celtic of Shaktar in the 2nd round. I suspect that some forum members have bought into early season hype and believe the team is nearly invincible. We now face the prospect of Milan or Barca, my two continental favorites. Milan disassembled a stellar Manchester United team last season; and Barca will probably have Eto'o back and Ronaldinho in better form by February.

We still have frailties. I think we are always about two injuries away from being just decent. If we went into ties against those teams without some combination of Hleb/Fabregas/Toure/Gallas, I would not fancy our chances. I think the last two Champs League games were an enormous miscalculation on Wenger's part, given the odds of facing a top European side.

 

[Zico]

Worst thing is, Sevilla beat us at our own game, playing good football

Late in the game, I said to my mate that we looked like a typical Arsenal opponent. We couldn't hold on to the ball, we couldn't get the ball away from them. They were absolutely incisive. 22 shots versus our 8 shows is evidence of the sort of dominance that we are used to enjoying versus the Readings of this world.

 

[number_0]

seriously which team do you fear the most?
milan is well past it, i dont think they can handle our pace, if we maintain it home and away.
roma is a decent attacking team, nothing we cant handle.
Real madrid seems to have some deciplines, i am worried here, but we have enough quality
barca: really inconsistant size, we will probebly up our games against them anyway.
inter: big worry here, dont watch them much, but they seem quality
porto: haha, next.

we arent the best team in europe, but non of the above teams are unbeatable, hope we get milan or inter in the second round, which ever team in the quarters and barca in the semis.
hope we dont face any english teams on the way though.

 

[vin de guerre]

So we lost! Until the last minute I would have been satisfied with a 2-1 reversal. Yes we were made to look quite ordinary and at times we were indeed "Arsenaled" but I feel this loss came at the right time to start moving up a gear for the next stage of the season.
With so many influencial players missing there was little chance we would come out of the game with a result. I hope the players who had bad games can come through the trauma since they have had little or no playing at this or EPL level in the last couple of months. I also hope Cesc is not sidelined and Hleb and RVP are back soon.
I still think we can finish top of this group since Seville have to go away to a very cold Prague and if they draw and we win at home then we go top because of the goal scored yesterday.

 

[banduan]

In Europe our worst opponents are ourselves.

Apologies for the cliche routine.

 

[Zico]

I would rather not get Milan, mate. What you are saying is exactly what Manchester fans were saying 6 months ago before they were thoroughly outclassed. Gattuso pulled a magic trick, making Christiano completely disappear. You don't want to have to track Seedorf AND Kaka. They're like Hleb and Rosicky on steroids. Milan could embarrass us.

I watch a lot of Serie A and Champs League, so I am not too concerned about Inter and Roma even though they are up to 11 points ahead of AC Milan. Milan have a much greater range in performances than any other big club, but have the veteran nous to neutralize any attack.

 

[CrazyInLoveWithArsenal]

I think that Porto will win thier group so I hope we get them. The other four group winners will most likely be Inter, AC, Barca or Real. Porto are clearly the weakest of those sides and in my opinion Inter is the strongest. Well there is a small possibilty that we might still be able to nick top spot should Sevilla fail to win at Slavia. As unlikely as that may be, its still a possibility.

I am dissapointed that we find ourselves in this position. We really should have beaten Slavia and at least drawn here today. Nonetheless, what is done is done. We now find ourselves in a uncomfortable position in Europe. Hopefully, Wenger choice to rest player will at least bring three points Villa Park.

To be honest, I almost forgot how it fell to loose and it feels horrible especially to loose in such manner. The 4-1 loss at Anfield last season was bad and for me this was on par. We looked loss and couldn't keep the ball. Sevilla looked by far the more superior footballing side, they played us off the park.

Watching the game was just so frustating, there were so many aspects of our game that was severly lacking. It was evident that outside our first eleven there is a significant dip in quality. Senderos and Hoyte are embarresments, its laughable to think that they are actually Arsenal players. Eboue is not good or intelligent enough to operate on the wing of a 'Arsenal' midfield. He looked decent today but the sad thing is this was one of his best preformances for us but he still looked just average.

Tactically, I feel Wenger got it wrong. Why he didn't play a 4-4-2 is beyond me. I can't wait for van Persie to come back because he is the only striker Wenger trust enough to play a four man midfield.

I want to forget about this game and just focus on the Premiership. We have three huge away games back to back before we play Chelsea on Super Sunday. I believe that the side can pick up nine points from the trips to the Riverside, Villa Park and St. James Park. If we can do that then we will go into Super Sunday six clear of United with the possibility os stretching that lead to nine points.

I say forget about this game and focus on the Premiership until Febuary when the knockout stage comes knocking.

 

[tactica442]

I think that Porto will win thier group so I hope we get them. The other four group winners will most likely be Inter, AC, Barca or Real. Porto are clearly the weakest of those sides and in my opinion Inter is the strongest. Well there is a small possibilty that we might still be able to nick top spot should Sevilla fail to win at Slavia. As unlikely as that may be, its still a possibility.

I am dissapointed that we find ourselves in this position. We really should have beaten Slavia and at least drawn here today. Nonetheless, what is done is done. We now find ourselves in a uncomfortable position in Europe. Hopefully, Wenger choice to rest player will at least bring three points Villa Park.

Agreed, what's done is done. AW had his calculated risk which the current circumstance allows him to do so.

I won't mind too much on which team Arsenal will get in the KO stage. Last season, Arsenal got PSV which was arguably a less prestigious team in Europe. Yet the only goal scored for Arsenal came from Alex's OG.

Let's hope the team can learn lessions from the Slavia & Sevilla games, forget about the results, and win ALL the league and CL games in December. That will be the correct way forward.